Windows 10 Privacy and security control general

vbimport

#1

This is a promised thread for installing and monitoring Windows 10 network traffic caused by Microsoft. My hope is that we collectively can contribute bits and pieces as to how to make Windows 10 our own and loosen Microsoft’s grip.

I notice several threads in here which all are to narrow, hence a new thread with a name general enough to encompass everything small and big.

For those just seeking a tool to help them get along, please look at O&O Shutup10 or check out 10se1ucgo’s Disable Windows 10 Tracking.
A few tools which may be of interest to the thread are the following hardware, developer and administrative tool kits

Download the standalone SDK if you just need the Debugging Tools for Windows 10, and not WDK 10 or Visual Studio Community 2015, you can install the tools as a standalone component from Windows SDK. In the installation wizard, select Debugging Tools for Windows, and deselect all other components.

Download the Windows Driver Kit (WDK) 10 Tools to build, test, and deploy drivers and Windows Store apps, including debugging tools, samples and tutorials. More Universal Windows driver samples.

Download the Windows Hardware Lab Kit (HLK) for Windows 10. Test performance and compatibility of hardware and drivers for Windows 10.

Download the Windows Assessment and Deployment Kit (ADK) for Windows 10. Improved deployment tools for automation of large-scale deployment of Windows 10. To my knowledge, it also includes the Windows PE environment

Seemingly aiming at a very technical thread, but a tip on how to protect privacy and be in control on Windows 10 does not have to be technical at all. If you have a question to the thread, please do not hesitate asking.

I will return once the first data from the installation and first startup has been analyzed.


#2

Xercus , I think this thread is a good idea.

Since MS is also hacking Windows 7 & 8.1 with many of the same methods using Windows update . Readers of this thread will find many of the settings apply to those older OSs.

I hope that the hard coded bypass of the hosts file added to some of the Windows Update installed [B].dll[/B] files can be verified.

From other posts I think you have the capability to monitor traffic to see what is still going out to Microsoft . After everything should have been blocked.
I may have to learn to do that but I’m starting with using information from others that are already experienced in doing it . I suspect it would take me a while to hone my skills at it.

Here are the links to two of the other threads .
I left out the one that was taken so far off topic.


#3

I’m posting a “hosts” file I found for the MS snooping sites .
I’m not recommending anyone add it to your hosts file but it is a reference for all the sites there may be .
If anyone had to “deny” all these individually with a firewall it would be a daunting task. At least it would for me.
[B]To make it clear I don’t recommend adding this to your hosts file .[/B]
Not at this time anyway.

MShosts.zip (34.7 KB)


#4

[QUOTE=cholla;2760179]Xercus , I think this thread is a good idea.

Since MS is also hacking Windows 7 & 8.1 with many of the same methods using Windows update . Readers of this thread will find many of the settings apply to those older OSs.

I hope that the hard coded bypass of the hosts file added to some of the Windows Update installed .dll files can be verified.

From other posts I think you have the capability to monitor traffic to see what is still going out to Microsoft . After everything should have been blocked.
I may have to learn to do that but I’m starting with using information from others that are already experienced in doing it . I suspect it would take me a while to hone my skills at it.

Here are the links to two of the other threads .
I left out the one that was taken so far off topic.

You are right in your assumptions of being able to monitor network traffic, it is hard to hide outside of the computer, and you have to phone home don’t you? The reason is simple, Virtualization is all about network bandwidth and enough network cards. I have a four port Intel VT and a dormant Intel PT two port among other Intel and Realtek network cards (T’is about being safe right?) The two port PT is a bridged, no services included thru-port where Wireshark can sniff everything going on without including the physical machine’s traffic.

I also agree that experience from and towards Windows 8 and 7 (not vista so much) is quite within the realm of this thread as it is needed to explain some functionality of Windows 10 and of course since MS is enforcing the same behavior on these operating systems. It will also include the hardcoded links, I assure you I’ll give it my best to figure out how to neutralize the effect in the process.

This should have been the girl’s night out and my night in and I had even bought myself a good bottle of single malt to go with it.
Then reality kicks in, and some friends come over for a visit!?
Is it just me or… I would like to have a heads up, especially when they are staying til tomorrow, like a chance to pepare breakfast for four instead of two!? Luckily, it is none of my business, I am married to a cook, a wizard working with food, known to perform miracles out of just water and tomorrow we’ll all have egg benedictine for breakfast. Thank god she’s home and I get to tell you I am a little bit delayed.
Please don’t let me be misunderstood, it is all joy and fun, I am just not too fond of surprises in this respect. Tomorrow means another test promised adding to it all.
It is said that noone grows old simply by living a number of years, but to give up on interest wrinkles your soul… DANG! I know a lot of people with wrinkled souls - half of me is at least pointing forward towards the unknown! Where were we if the five year old stopped asking why? :confused:


#5

Looking forward to see what you find.

I’m a good cook myself.
I can’t make egg benedictine out of water though.
Nice trick.


#6

[QUOTE=cholla;2760206]Looking forward to see what you find.

I can’t make egg benedictine out of water though.
Nice trick.[/QUOTE]

You’re right, pure magic, no less :bigsmile:

Information pre-testing
Before I start to go into the details, this is a test-system which was created solely for these tests, but the HD will be kept in case it is needed for further tests later on. This means that user GUID, OS specific name for machine and other personal information can be passed on without fear of a privacy breach. I do have a valid registration for all installations - serials used however are well in the grey, but all are valid as of today and Windows retail activation went ok (the log for that is with the install). As noted above, a dual port Intel Pro 1000 PT PCI-E network card installed in my general server test-rig serves as the man-in-the-middle logging computer. This makes it impossible for any network traffic to hide from view. The machine will pass through this network card at all times though I will only capture the interesting parts.

Now then, where was I? Oh yes, somewhat more troublesome than I thought as the harddrive with Windows 7 pro retail died on me during the process (quite bad quality for Toshiba 2.5" about 3 years ago? I have replaced 6 during the last year). This means I can not show what the upgrade process calls home about. :confused:

Swapped to a Hitachi 2.5" and installed Windows pro retail from scratch this morning.
ISO: en_windows_10_multiple_editions_x64_dvd_6846432.iso | Name: J_CCSA_X64FRE_EN-US_DV5 | 4 083 853 312 bytes

The install is silent at the network card until it boots Windows for the first time. Then it starts the usual stuff:
Destination | Protocol | Info | reverse lookup
104.84.140.208 | TLSv1.2 | Client Key Exchange, Change Cipher Spec, Hello Request, Hello Request | a104-84-140-208.deploy.static.akamaitechnologies.com
104.41.150.68 | NTP | NTP Version 3, client | No ptr Record exist
104.95.178.35 | TLSv1.2 | Client Key Exchange, Change Cipher Spec, Hello Request, Hello Request | a104-95-178-35.deploy.static.akamaitechnologies.com
104.95.179.206 | TLSv1.2 | Client Key Exchange, Change Cipher Spec, Hello Request, Hello Request | a104-95-179-206.deploy.static.akamaitechnologies.com
108.162.232.199 | HTTP | HTTP/1.1 GET | a108-162-232-199.deploy.static.akamaitechnologies.com
Command line: GET /MFQwUjBQME4wTDAJBgUrDgMCGgUABBQmECJms4f7i5EbxtN7NbzQCBwAdAQUUa8kJpz0aCJXgCYrO0ZiFXsezKUCE1oAAAu8ZFRjK%2BsWa0UAAQAAC7w%3D
108.162.232.204 | HTTP | HTTP/1.1 GET | …and so on

  • There are no local rules for the firewall at this stage and Windows update is free to catch up. I will have to find a program to analyze the installation log as it is 340MB and probably will be retired by the time I finish a manual run. I’ll let that pass for now to get going :iagree:

Once up and running, I did a few installation to make it easier for myself to analyze registry and so on. I do not recommend the programs in any way, but the installations are as follows:
Registry WorkShop v4.62 - I am registered since years ago and just knows the ins and outs of it. I would personally be interested in information of a freeware doing the same (more on this later)
RunFromProcess - From time to time it is interesting to run the registry editor in the context of the [B]System[/B] account to have access to keys that you normally can’t get to.
O&O ShutUp10 - I thought I’d start by showing the registry changes caused by this program.
Windows Firewall Control - Just an extention to the Windows firewall. For a test-system, this is a better choice than applying my settings from scratch as it will report whatever trying to communicate on the net.
TeamViewer (may be present in logs so a note is needed)… and a few more non-essential programs - More essential installations may follow…

Manually configuring the Windows firewall used to be done wia the NetSh command like this:
[B]netsh advfirewall firewall add rule name=“descriptive name” dir=out/in action=allow/block program=“Full path and name for file” enable=yes[/B], alternatively, it can be done from the controlpanel by selecting [B]Windows Firewall[/B] and [B]Advanced Settings[/B]
Why Windows Firewall Control you may ask. The reason is that it is supposed to work in conjunction with the man-in-the-middle machine running Wireshark. Together I figure they may give a complete picture and a way to easily pinpoint where in the wireshark-log the communication can be found. There will be no communication taking place before I manually click “Allow this program”. That is the sort of control needed for the task of what-when-why.

First of all, let us take a tour and see what happens to the registry when we apply the [B]recommended[/B] and [B]limited recommended[/B] settings found in [B]O&O ShutUp10[/B]. I will do a quick explanation of what I did to produce the result afterwards. The result also show why I prefer to work in Registry WorkShop than in a text editor.

Evidently, the tree-view makes the result more tidy to work with and the program can open many registry files at once and if you add to that the possibility to right-click and add any of the settings from any open registry file and add it to your registry individually and you have a good utility. I do not want to recommend trialware, hence the question of a freeware with the same possibilitiy.

The entire registry file is 414 lines long and is too big for the thread. It can be downloaded here. Only a few settings are reviewed below.

Deny access to list of preferred languages (I prefer english for anything computer related, it is enough that many sites insist on putting up a Norwegian login before realising my settings, I hate that!)
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\Control Panel\International\User Profile]
“HttpAcceptLanguageOptOut”=dword:00000001

Stop giving away Advertising ID (it seems a very good idea :wink: )
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\AdvertisingInfo]
“Enabled”=dword:00000000

Let Apps use your account info (fat chance!)
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\DeviceAccess\Global{C1D23ACC-752B-43E5-8448-8D0E519CD6D6}]
“Value”=“Deny”

Let Apps use your calendar info (not me)
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\DeviceAccess\Global{D89823BA-7180-4B81-B50C-7E471E6121A3}]
“Value”=“Deny”

Let Apps use your camera (could be interesting for som I guess, I have a Post-It in front of the lens when not in use - I never seem to get around to buy a USB one as I use it maybe once a year)
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\DeviceAccess\Global{E5323777-F976-4f5b-9B55-B94699C46E44}]
“Value”=“Deny”

Let Apps use your microphone (could be interesting for some, I have a USB microphone if I need one, the built in is disabled in my BIOS)
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\DeviceAccess\Global{2EEF81BE-33FA-4800-9670-1CD474972C3F}]
“Value”=“Deny”

Let Apps use your location info (now come on, need my address as well?)
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\DeviceAccess\Global{BFA794E4-F964-4FDB-90F6-51056BFE4B44}]
“Value”=“Deny”

Let Apps use your radios (without my knowledge? Forget it!)
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\DeviceAccess\Global{A8804298-2D5F-42E3-9531-9C8C39EB29CE}]
“Value”=“Deny”

Let Apps use notifikations (I guess even this may be interesting for some)
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\PushNotifications]
“ToastEnabled”=dword:00000000

Stop windows for automatically update your drivers from the internet
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Wow6432Node\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\DriverSearching]
“SearchOrderConfig”=dword:00000000

Stop Windows automatic update (I like this kind of control)
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\WindowsUpdate\AU]
“NoAutoUpdate”=dword:00000001

Windows biometrics (soon you can pop in your blood type on a needle as well I guess - phew!)
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Biometrics]
“Enabled”=dword:00000000

Turn off the lockscreen camera (beats me)
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\Personalization]
“NoLockScreenCamera”=dword:00000001

Stop Handwriting data sharing (unless there is a good reason to…)
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\InputPersonalization]
“RestrictImplicitTextCollection”=dword:00000001
"RestrictImplicitInkCollection"=dword:00000001
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\TabletPC]
“PreventHandwritingDataSharing”=dword:00000001

Disable Location and Sensors (unless there is a good reason not to)
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\LocationAndSensors]
“DisableLocation”=dword:00000001
"DisableSensors"=dword:00000001

Stop One Drive from syncing (may be interesting to those using it, I got my own noone-else-drive)
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\OneDrive]
“DisableFileSyncNGSC”=dword:00000001

Stop answering location requests (!)
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SYSTEM\ControlSet001\Control\Storage\EnabledDenyGP]
“DenyAllGPState”=dword:00000001

Stop Password Reveal (general protection, it may or may not be a good idea depending on your own control)
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\CredUI]
“DisablePasswordReveal”=dword:00000001

Disable web content evaluation
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\AppHost]
“EnableWebContentEvaluation”=dword:00000000

Deny sync between devices (nice feature until you do one mistake like deleting your contacts, then you’ll agree)
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\DeviceAccess\Global\LooselyCoupled]
“Value”=“Deny”

Stop automatic WebSearch using Bing (I like to be in charge)
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\Search]
“BingSearchEnabled”=dword:00000000

WiFi Sense (and ship your Wi-Fi password to MS - Great!)
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Siuf\Rules]
“NumberOfSIUFInPeriod”=dword:00000000

Stop Cortana and/or disable Cortana Websearch (mix and match to your preference)
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\Windows Search]
“AllowCortana”=dword:00000000
"DisableWebSearch"=dword:00000001

Application Telemetry (info harvesting? Yeah right!)
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\AppCompat]
“AITEnable”=dword:00000000
"DisableInventory"=dword:00000001
"DisableUAR"=dword:00000001

Genral Telemetry (also in Wow6432Node) - (info harvesting? Yeah right!)
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\DataCollection]
“AllowTelemetry”=dword:00000000

Media Digital Rights Management Internet Access (I do not want any DRM shit on my machine, period.)
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\WMDRM]
“DisableOnline”=dword:00000001

Defer Windows Upgrades
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Policies\Microsoft\Windows\WindowsUpdate]
“DeferUpgrade”=dword:00000001

Stop Window Update for other Microsoft products
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Wow6432Node\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\WindowsUpdate\Services\7971f918-a847-4430-9279-4a52d1efe18d]
“RegisteredWithAU”=dword:00000000

Window Update Sharing (sharing updates through P2P from local machines with the update already downloaded)
[HKEY_CURRENT_USER\SOFTWARE\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\DeliveryOptimization]
“SystemSettingsDownloadMode”=dword:00000000
[HKEY_LOCAL_MACHINE\SOFTWARE\Wow6432Node\Microsoft\Windows\CurrentVersion\DeliveryOptimization\Config]
“DODownloadMode”=dword:00000000

For a full view, please download the true .reg file here
Of course, to get the results, I did a snapshot before applying the ShutUp 10 and after. Then I compared the two snapshots and the difference was saved as the downloadable reg-file.

Well, that is all for now, next up will be to look into the ever so slow communication mentioned by Cholla. I still do not know what it will take to get to the truth of that, but we better. The unknown is such a discomforting place to stay. :flower:


#7

It is no doubt you are much better equipped to check the traffic I am.
It will be interesting to see how O&O ShutUp10 does at stopping the traffic to MS.

I still don’t know if O&O ShutUp10 would work on a Windows 7 OS .
Or work correctly .
I think many of the registry settings would be the same but would it apply them ?

To add to the complication for myself I’m using a Windows 7 32-bit .
I need to do this for a piece of VOIP hardware I use for Skype .
No drivers available for 64 bit.
My laptop however has Windows 7 64-bit & I want to keep it from being hacked by MS as well. It doesn’t have a web cam I bought it that way on purpose .

I hope that O&O ShutUp10 stops the data traffic to MS cold .
It would be great if it is that well programed.

I downloaded both registry files & I will be looking them over.


#8

I’ll try to get to that once I staggered my own curiosity towards the mysterious traffic you mentioned. I don’t know yet if I have to do any hacking to figure out all ip addresses connected to. I need to lock monitoring to just these and hopefully generate a meaningful log over time.

I have a total of 12 ports and can free up two more without compromising virtual machine privacy before having to resort to using VLANs. Then I can use a virtual machine to sniff that traffic and do double tests. I would like to have the test-computers physical for these tests even though I could use virtual network cards and route traffic. It means however that the machine would be more aware of what is going on. As it is now, the bridge is as dummy as can be and does not generate traffic of its own. I like the transparency and sterile logs from this approach.

All changes by ShutUp10 are reverted back to MS defaults, I do not know if it will interfere with what I seek to find out, but it will be applied once the test is done.

It is a good idea though, wether or not the ShutUp10 settings can be applied and if, which will have any effect on Windows 7? I figure a fully updated Windows 7 no exclusions would be needed… Phew!, That’s 5-6 hours of just waiting whie MS installs all the shit and then some… I guess. I’ll try to dig up a retail non-MAK there as well and set up another test-computer to make the tests as generally usable as possible and to help speed up testing.


#9

You are going to a great deal of work to do this .
I appreciate it & I hope others will benefit from it also.

I’m sure the information on Windows 10 you get will be close if not the same for Windows 7 . Since MS is trying to add the data collection to W7 with updates.

I agree it’s a major task to completely update a fresh install .

So for a start let’s see what you find on Windows 10.


#10

Think nothing of it Cholla, it is my hobby, more so than my profession what I do in this thread. Thank the community, if it is one I owe my participation to, it is this.
While I bought my first Plextor PX-40TSi back in 1997 (if my memory serves me right), still use one and probably the five new UltraPlex 40’s I’ve got left on my shelf is going to serve my music ripping needs for the rest of my life. I have used mostly Plextors only since then, and this forum have always been one I have read, taken notes, snapped, even added my own comments without participating.
It is as such an old debt payback choosing to participate.
I probably still do not have much to add to the seasoned CD-freaks in here, but on the subject of OS and general computing, I have more than a few tricks of my own and so it is my pleasure to hopefully add something that can be of value to the forum as a whole.


#11

I apprichate it, I have been out of the busness for over 20 years, Not Comp. Stupid. Just not as smart anymore


#12

Xercus,
I’m glad you find all this work enjoyable as your hobby. I would still like to thank you for the efforts, it’s more than appreciated. I was heading towards Apple as an alternative! I would rather not. I really hate the thought that a huge corporation like Microsoft can spy on me. Like Thor21344 I’ve nothing bad to hide, but what I like to use my computers for and my personal information is mine and only shared with those I wish to.

Underhanded secretive data gathering is not on really, after all, phone tapping is illegal in the UK and probably elsewhere, but the equivalent tapping of private computers to me is just the same, but it seems to be legal and allowed.
If you can find a practical way of blocking Microsoft’s continued underhand data collection, more power to you.
I’m sure if Microsoft properly asked if they can gather fully disclosed limited data to improve Windows, I think most people wouldn’t mind, but as I have said before, Microsoft has “previous” and are not trusted any more.


#13

[B]Letter from Microsoft[/B]

                Due to our Data collection initiative, we have decided that you are qualified to lead our [B] " Get secret information about everyone in the world " [/B]department.   The salary is commensurate with the amount of secret and exploitive information you can provide us with so we as a yet unknown part of the US Governments initiative to know everything about everybody and then exploit them to the max is accomplished. Glad to have you aboard.

                                                                                   Sincerely
                                                                               Name withheld;)

#14

[QUOTE=cholla;2760187]I’m posting a “hosts” file I found for the MS snooping sites .
I’m not recommending anyone add it to your hosts file but it is a reference for all the sites there may be .
If anyone had to “deny” all these individually with a firewall it would be a daunting task. At least it would for me.
[B]To make it clear I don’t recommend adding this to your hosts file .[/B]
Not at this time anyway.

[/QUOTE]

Thanks for your hard efforts. :clap:


#15

If I can add anything to this forum I’ll do my best… :slight_smile:


#16

Just a short note.
I am not dead, nor gone - I just got kidnapped by my own family for a surprise vacation in connection with my 50th birthday. Everybody conspired against me it seems, even customers and so they managed to pull it off without raising any suspicion on my behalf… I had been in a meeting, needed get some parts to rectify a troubled infrastructure. and was caught totally off guard.
No ransome was set, only one strict rule to follow: NO COMPUTERS, touch one and you’ll die! :bigsmile:

'nuff said - I’m home, still my appologies to the thread for not being able to tell… i’ll get back to it shortly, I can confirm however, that Windows 7 became fully updated all by itself while I was away :flower:


#17

[I]“Windows 7 became fully updated all by itself while I was away”[/I]

I can confirm that windows 7 now downloads auto updates although I have set it to notify me only! I wish I knew what update they have sneaked in to do this.
Has anyone else had this happen? Updates now keeps on badgering me to install 10, not on this rig baby!!!

I’ve built a test rig to see what Windows 10 actually does, well it’s corrupted it’s self twice, and a clean install was the next step. Yeah, it installed OK, but When I try to use various programmes that worked fine on 7 and 8.1 it gets it’s knickers in a twist. I realise it’s new, but it’s still a pain in the ass. :Z


#18

[QUOTE=voxsmart;2760883]I’ve built a test rig to see what Windows 10 actually does, well it’s corrupted it’s self twice, and a clean install was the next step. Yeah, it installed OK, but When I try to use various programmes that worked fine on 7 and 8.1 it gets it’s knickers in a twist. I realise it’s new, but it’s still a pain in the ass. :Z[/QUOTE]

That is very strange, Can you open your event viewer [Right-click the start button, select “Event viewer”. Once the window is open, in the left pane, click on “Administrative Events”.
With that selected, you should get loads of results in the topmost pane in the middle. Are there many red “Critical” and “Error” status for events in the “Level” Column. If so, can you pinpoint any that is persistent by looking at the “Source” column for the errors.
When you click on a line in the top pane, you will get details in the lower pane. It may or may not mean much to you, but it means a world of difference.

If any of the above holds true, could you reply with the following data from the lower pane fields

  • The entire contents from the descriptive box in the “General” tab
  • Source
  • Event ID:
    (text can be snapped for all field data and you do not have to add the actual name shown above)

If there are many the repeats at all times, snap as many as you can.:iagree:


#19

That seems useful Xercus, now I can’t get past the start window.
The first screen you need to press a key to get the password box to appear. It sticks there. Any ideas on how to make it to respond. I have changed the keyboard, tried a different USB socket, but apart from the num lock light being on, the keyboards do nothing.
If I can get past this annoyance, I will go in to the event viewer and see if there is anything useful there.
I beginning to suspect a hardware fault somewhere although all of its guts were working on 7 previously.

The other interesting thing is when I tried to put 10 on my new laptop, it also corrupted with the pre installed software that is actually useful. (All the bloat crap has been removed) It’s a very new Toshiba machine. I had to revert to 8.1 to recover it. That ended up with the start screen flashing on and off forever if I had left it. Enough for now, I’m thinking of doing another clean install on the test rig and using the Acronis try and see app that may also be useful.


#20

[QUOTE=voxsmart;2760958]That seems useful Xercus, now I can’t get past the start window.
The first screen you need to press a key to get the password box to appear. It sticks there. Any ideas on how to make it to respond. I have changed the keyboard, tried a different USB socket, but apart from the num lock light being on, the keyboards do nothing.
… and using the Acronis try and see app that may also be useful.[/QUOTE]

First, for your laptop which you reverted, make sure you have a local media to install from:
https://www.microsoft.com/en-us/software-download/windows10
http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-10/media-creation-tool-install?ocid=ms_wol_win10

If you are at the start screen, I would try the old and proven method of pressing the [B][Ctrl][Alt][Delete][/B] keys at the same time.

I do believe it is too early to conclude with a hardware fault being the cause of your trouble. It may have something to do with hardware, but since you are able to install the update, it should be correctable.

The NumLock light being on only means there is power from the USB port, but here is the clue. If you can press the [B][NumLock][/B] key and the light goes on and off with every press, then there is communication between the computer and keyboard. If it does not, the keyboard is not communicating. You can check this at a restart and see when the communication stops by repeatedly pressing the [B][NumLock][/B] key during the bootup process. If the Windows logo is up when it happens, I think you may be in need of a BIOS upgrade.

Another thing to do is to go into BIOS at bootup by pressing typically either [B][F1][/B], [B][F2][/B], [B][ESC][/B] or [B][DEL][/B] (if not, check the manual) if you can navigate the settings using the keyboard (unless mouse navigated), there is nothing wrong with it.
Once in the BIOS, use the arrow keys to navigate if there is no support for mouse. search for a setting named “[B]Quick Boot[/B]” “[B]Fast Boot[/B]” or similar. If you find it, turn it off for now. Next search for “[B]USB Legacy support[/B]” and if “Off”,turn it “On”. If there is a setting for “[B]USB Always On[/B]” activate it and if there is a setting in “[B]Power options[/B]” to turn off unused USB ports, disable it.

Here is a small “prior to upgrade” list you can check if you really need to re-install. FWIW if you are at the login screen, I can not see any reason to.

[B]HW Vendor’s Website, support section[/B]
(Since you have upgraded, for BIOS, you will have to download a bootable ISO/USB version, not the Windows executable and upgrade by booting from CD. On some vendor sites, this is not listed with the OS specific updates. If that is the case, try searching for “fimware udate” “bios image”, “bootable bios”)

  1. BIOS Updates
  2. Check modelspecific notes for Windows 10 compatibility
  3. Download available drivers for Windows 10

[B]Uninstallations[/B]
4. Windows 8.1 GUI enhancements (ClassicShell, Start 8, ModernMix etc.)
5. Third-party Antivirus and Firewall solutions
6. Camera & Scanner driver (and for your laptop if applicable, also the drivers for the Graphic card)

[B]Preparation[/B]
7. Disconnect all external Peripherals apart from mouse and keyboard
8. If applicable, connect mouse and keyboard to USB2 ports

[B]Maybees & Couldbees[/B]

  • Deactivate Wi-Fi card in BIOS
  • Deactivate Soundcard in BIOS
    (They can be activated after upgrade)

[B]And since you mention Acronis[/B].
I have not checked after 06.2014, but because of the way their USB upperfilter driver works, you are likely to experience unrecognized USB devices more often than others.
It is a good precaution uninstalling Acronis products prior to upgrading