What's the world coming to? all DVDs suck

vbimport

#1

but seriously, what DVDs are we supposed to use? every single brand seems to be put down for deterioration and PI errors. prodisc, ridata, princo, fujifilm, daxon, vakoss, CMC magnetics, moser baer india, and all the crappy brands. yes i realise i’ve thrown in brand names as well as manufacturers, but you get the point.

so about all that’s left is TY, verbatim and ricoh, (and i’ve heard good things about sony but yeah.)

now fuji TYs are gone, and they had some sort of “speckling problems” anyway. so what am i supposed to do? buy unbranded TY from blankmedia.ca? how do i trust it if it doesn’t have a brand name? what if the quality is inconsistent, who do i complain to? am i supposed to ship my media back to blankmedia.ca? forget it…

RICOHJPN03 are in some of the memorex 16x at future shop. so? i’ve seen some very poor quality scans coming out of this community on those discs. that’s disappointing, i guess i’m not buying those.

verbatim costs $0.70 per disk which is quite a bit. it is beginning to look like my only option, however many people try to tell you that they’re no good, because of previous experience. i find this quite strange. …i would get the pastels but they seem unavailable in canada.

does anyone else ever feel frustrated that there are just no good discs at all out there?


#2

Yup =)


#3

so i’m not going completely nuts… thank god.


#4

Discs have never been cheaper. There’s tons of good stuff available, just not all of it at 16x. For those of us that burn at 8x or lower, things are just fine.

I have about 500 TYG02s (branded Fuji) with no “speckling issues”. Even if they did, Fuji has a great warranty replacement with free shipping each way (in the US at least). These discs are still available at many Staples in 30pks for less than 35c each. Ritek, Prodisc, TYG01/02, MUST 003 and others all work great at 4-8x. Just how many brands do you need? Find one and stick with it. You need to burn at 16x, you pay more and get less selection.

-Evan-


#5

Ritek is junk, though. If you don’t want your DVD unreadable in a year, mark that off your list. I would avoid the Prodisc F01s, as I’ve yet to see any scans I would find acceptable. I have, however, seen Prodisc S03s that burned well consistently on a BenQ1640, but that’s not 100s of burns. If you get Fuji at Staples in the 30pk, make sure it says Made in Japan–those will have an entirely white plastic cover, whereas the Made in Taiwain (Prodisc F01s) will have a slight blue tinge on the left and right sides of the plastic overlay–avoid those.


#6

At the same time you want quality, but you don’t want to pay for it? In my opinion, this is a part of the whole problem.

Discs are cheap now. Personally I consider $0.70 cheap for a good disc that’s reliable and holds up 4.7 GB of data. Come on, this was the price of premium CDRs just three years ago. Double this amount and it’s still cheaper than a VHS 240mn cassette!!!

That’s exactly why the market is flooded with crap, that’s because people want cheap stuff. So what do you think the manufacturers go for? Cheap production! “Buy cheap, buy twice”. It’s always been, and will always be, true. You can’t ask for quality and at the same time want extremely low prices. You get what you pay for. Yeah, I know, I’m writing used old sentences, but hey, some truths are never voiced enough.

If everyone would agree to pay $0.50 to $0.70 per disc, I bet most manufacturers would produce better media. Ritek for example have the technological means to produce great media. But as long as brands ask them to produce at minimum cost, they’ll keep on producing crap series. What are the less unreliable Riteks? The most expensive ones: Traxdata (I’m not advising to buy these ;), it’s just to illustrate my point).

Why do you think that the best discs available, Verbatim and Taiyo Yuden (and some more or less un-available discs, like genuine in-house manufactured Maxells, that are quite hard to find nowadays), are the most expensive? Think about it for 5 minutes. Yeah, we all know Ricoh is great and somewhat cheaper, but then guess what? Variation between batches…

About TY: “how do i trust it if it doesn’t have a brand name?”
By listening to the advice of good folks here on this forum, who will tell you to buy them from a reliable source, like rima.com in the USA or SVP in Europe. There are other good alternatives, just browse the forum.
If you want a brand, the Plextor 8X are TYG02, at a lesser price (at least in Europe) than the Verbatim pastels.

If you really don’t want to pay the price for premium media, well, don’t expect premium media! :disagree:


#7

I concur with most of that above. With a little effort, I have no problem getting the some of the best media made for less than $40 per 100 delivered.

As for the brand name issue, the only reliable brand name I have ever found has been Verbatim. Almost all others run hot and cold. I have not bought any media from a local store in over 3 years and I routinely pass even when the price looks good as it is almost always a crap shoot as to whether the “brand” will be the good stuff or not. Not worth the cost of the drive.


#8

To each his own, but based on my own experience I’d have to disagree. I keep scanning through my Ritek G04/G05 stock and there’s no problem. A lot of the G05s are over a year old, the G04s over two years. I don’t mean to make light of your experiences (I take it that you’ve personally experienced Ritek failure, and aren’t repeating other forum posters). I’ve also burned enough Prodisc F01s to be happy with them. Of course, I’ve had the opposite experience with S03s which gave me 50/50 odds in my 106. Naturally. :wink:

Also, I only buy Fuji 30pks MIJ. Prodisc can be had at a much lower price, however they aren’t as compatible with some of my readers so I stick with TYG02 (as I said).

-Evan-


#9

Keep an eye on future Fujis. I have heard from many reliable sources that Fuji is switching from TY.


#10

Thanks, I will. I did buyout the local Staples’ TY stock last time they had a sale. Between that and my Ritek stock I should be good for a long while. Just out of curiosity, what are they switching to? Something MIJ?

-Evan-


#11

I heard rumors of Prodisc. Quite a drop in quality. I haven’t seen consistent Prodisc since S03.


#12

I think this makes things clearer… and explains probably why you and I had, some time ago, this hot discussion about Ritek media. As you can see in this post, all G04 I’ve buyed until september 2004 are still good. Most of the ones I’ve buyed since this time are showing fast degradation. I even sorted the serial numbers…
Do you have actual experience (including quality scans) with more recent Ritek G04 and G05 discs? Forget Traxdata, they seem to have the real A-grade stuff (though I’ve heard bad reports about them recently - but mine are still fine).


#13

This is also what I have concluded as well, although my timeline for Ritek starts in Spring of 2004 with the first reports of problems with G04 quality. I still have some of that and it had high errors but they did not get substantially worse. Older than that was still the good stuff. After Spring/2004 the crap gradually pervaded the globe, starting in Europe.

The problem with G05 is different and started around Feb./2005. There the discs looked good and burned very well but then began to deteriorate very rapidly. Again, not all.

So it does no one any good to point out that YOUR Ritek is just fine. Of course it is and no one here says anything different. However, your Ritek’s condition has no bearing on anyone elses Ritek, nor does it necessarily apply to all your Ritek.

The thing that still amazes me is why anyone would continue to buy something with such an erratic and unpredictible record of poor quality. There are, after all, plenty of other choices.

It is like buying dummy hand grenades when some are live, yet you can’t tell one from the other until months after you pull the pin.


#14

Well, stock up the next time there are sales on quality media. Are you near a BestBuy or Circuit City?? Those stores have regular sales.
Even though Fuji is now MIT, Sony still has MIJ media. Verbatim is still quality stuff, and Supermediastore and Rima are great online stores for top notch media.


#15

Regarding Fuji no longer using TY media…

Is it safe to say that if I find a “Made in Japan” Fujifilm DVD+R spindle, then it’s still TY media? Do you know if the new Prodisc media with the Fujifilm label will still say “Made in Japan”? I’m just trying to figure out how we can differentiate between the old good TY media and the new crappy Prodisc media. Thanks…


#16

Prodisc isn’t made in Japan AFAIK, so yeah, MIJ = Taiyo Yuden only.


#17

I mostly agree with you but at the same time I suggest that you read:

Last C’t media study/roundup english transcription thanks to MediumRare:
http://cdrlabs.com/phpBB/viewtopic.php?p=142231#142231
[link also appearing in the signature of Franksoy]


#18

Well if you happen to refer to me, let me clarify: I knew nothing of DVD testing until… october 2004. :o

I discovered CDFeaks… on may 2005. :rolleyes: (yeah, this s***ks).

Up to december 2004, I had bought lots of G04 (Ridiscs and Traxdatas) because they worked pretty well and were extremely compatible with all my drives. I used these discs only for video purposes (I already knew from different sources that Verbatim and Maxell were a better choices for important data backups). I bought them in large quantities, so when I started scanning them at the end of 2005, it was only discs from stock that I bought by early 2004. The scans were very good, so I had no reason to suspect problems. So I bought some more.

Early 2005, I heard that the production of 4X discs would stop, and as the only faster discs that worked well in my standalone recorder were Verbatim 02RG20 (I didn’t know anything about TY DVDs at that time :o and had only tried 2 or 3 kinds of discs), and these Verbs were still much more expensive than G04 at that thime, I ordered lots of these G04 so to be sure to have a stock of discs that my standalone recorder would be happy with, at a reasonable price.

I discovered the degradation problem of late G04 production only after that… too late. :doh: I had a stock of 300 blanks left… I still have about 150 of them I think.

Actually I’m not too unhappy with this problem, because it lead me to lots of research about DVD and CD quality, the discovery of CDFreaks, performing hundreds of scans, in-house climatic testing of discs in a chinese steamer (lots of fun :bigsmile: ) etc… well it turned me into a CD/DVD freak. :wink:

Of course, as soon as I discovered the problem, I stopped buying these discs! And I was then “knowledgable” enough to detect the G05 issues much faster… :wink:

Now I buy: Verbatim mainly, some TY for the pleasure, some Ricoh for fun. I would still buy MIJ Maxells but I can’t find them anymore. The only Ritek discs I still buy are CDs. They haven’t messed up with their CD production (yet?), it seems.


#19

Hi Franz :slight_smile: - About the last C’t study, there’s one thing that baffles me, it’s the test results with TYG02. It conlicts both the experience of dozens of avdanced users, and my own climatic tests were these discs were second only to MCC 02RG20.

Either they had a very bad batch of TYG02, or Mediumrare made a mistake in the transcription, or C’t themselves made a mistake at the writing stage… anyway there’s something no quite right here.


#20

Thanks Franksoy for asking my opinion about TYG02
Unfortunaly I have no much experience with TYG02.

For videos that I like to keep I am still burning

My main interest in the c’t magazine study is to find out: