Warning: RICOH-branded MBIPG101 R04 (+R 8X) - fast degradation

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#1

Hi guys :slight_smile:

I’ll post the scans later, promise. I found a successor to the (in)famous Ritek G05 with these Ricoh branded MBIPG101 R04.

I was quite happy with this MID under the TDK brand, 100% trouble-free, so I ordered a 50 discs spindle of the Ricoh ones in march. Three months after the burns (in 3 different burners), all the discs re-tested show a dramatic increase in errors (in 2 different scanners). :doh: - from average PIE 20 to average PIE 130!! :eek:
Of all the discs I used during the last two years, only Ritek G05 (most) and G04 (some) behaved like this. :a

No unreadable disc yet, luckily… I can transfer everything to different discs. Feeew. :rolleyes: - I’ll ask SVP if they’re OK to replace these discs (they’ll probably be).

#2

Looking forward to those scans :eek: - and I hope my Imation ones don’t show the same behaviour!

Nice to see you, BTW :wink:

#3

Thanks for the info Frank :bow:

I was planning to buy some of these media, but now I’m not so sure

#4

Don’t panic just yet. The TDK MBIPG101 R04 are totally stable and maybe these Ricoh were from a so-so batch. Everyone should know by now that MBI can produce both premium and so-so media with the exact same MID… :rolleyes: let’s hope they’ll get their act together…

Nice to see you, BTW :wink:
Same here :flower:

There are safer options at SVP these days if you want to try something else than the usual TY/MCC. The Imation-branded and HP-branded CMC MAG E01 are very good and apparently 100% stable (at least the ones I used are).

Scans tomorrow, sorry, no access to my scans database right now. :frowning:

#5

Hi Franck, I’m sure you stored the discs under decent conditions, but could you mention the specifics of how they were stored? Not that I suspect storage to blame, but it’s always good to note the storage conditions of any discs that have significant deterioration, if only so that it can be more or less ruled out as a possible cause.

#6

Couldn’t such a statement be made about virtually all the major manufacturers of DVD +/-R media :wink:

#7

Hi dear chap :slight_smile:
Good point. Not everyone knows how careful I am with my discs! :bigsmile: (nor that I would certainly rule out all possibilities like dust, scratches, scanning discrepancies etc… before reporting degradation :wink: )
These disc were stored exactly like all my other discs, in the same model of slim-line black DVD cases, in the same room, vertically, away from heat (< 23 C) and high humidity (< 55 %).

Not quite. I wrote “premium”, not simply “good”. :wink: - which implies that only a handful of manufacturers would fit such a description IMO. But I get your point.

Here’s one of the discs, before/after (3 months interval). Quite representative.

Before anyone starts arguing about the scanner used and the scanning speed as possible variables, I’ll precise that I’ve been using this 3540A unit as a reference scanner for quite some time now, and I’ve come to know its behaviour extremely well. The important point here is that it’s a totally consistent scanner (2 passes of the same disc show negligible, almost identical results). It has a magnifying effect on PIE variation, which is very useful to check for media degradation… the very reason why I use this drive to watch the stability of my discs. :wink: and 12X scans are almost identical as 5X scans, which saves MUCH time. :smiley:

This disc has been burnt in a Benq 1650/BCDC/8X/SB ON/WOPC ON.

  1. Original scan 6 march 2006
  2. Scan 19 june 2006

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#8

/me is scared :eek:

There is a big difference between two scans :frowning:

#9

So am I. Never saw such a thing except with Ritek -R discs. :disagree:

#10

I have experienced similar issues with low-quality MBI discs, surprisingly with Imation and TDK-branded MBI discs.
(As I didn’t do scans at that time, I’m not exactly sure whether it was a problem with the discs or an initial awful burn, but discs seemed to get worse with time.)

The reviews for RICOH-branded MBI DVD media on Amazon.de are bad too… :iagree:

#11

Me three. That is pretty scary!

I’ve taken onboard your advice about the TDKs - as I’ve been noticing the same stability with my backups on those discs.

:slight_smile:

And after what kg_evilboy just said, my Imations will come under close scrutiny (same MBI MID). I do remain hopeful about these, though - as you said, Imation branded CMC MAG E01 is very stable.

#12

I’m surprised. I’ve used lots of the TDK-branded MBIPG101 R04 and they were not only excellent to start with, but seem to be also totally stable. I know that [B]Dee-27[/B] (moderator and author of modified NEC firmwares together with [B]Liggy[/B]) has used lots of these discs too, and came to like them a lot. I think [B]Arachne[/B] also praises these discs ;). (edit - just take a look at the post above this one :bigsmile: )

I have no experience with the Imation-branded ones. I’ve used only CMCMAGE01 coded discs from Imation.

#13

Hehe, posting frenzy :bigsmile: (I edited) :wink:

#14

Now I’m mad at [B]Arachne [/B]and [B]Francksoy[/B].*
They praised MBIPG101 R04 so much that I wanted to try some, and as I could not find the TDK ones, I bought these Ricoh just a week ago. :doh:

Now I’m hesitating between not opening the cakebox and returning the media, or burning a couple and check in several weeks to see if they do the same… :bigsmile: - well… er… Iiiiiii’ll… return them. I don’t need the aggravation. :disagree:

*just kidding of course. :flower: to the both of you

#15

So let me be the devils advocate in this case or the MBIL defender. (Don’t think the last thing is correct. But will see :slight_smile: )

All problems on Amazon are related to initial burning errors.
Yeah well let me say this I can burn these RICOH MBIL disc’s very nice with my Philips DVDR1648P1 P2.3 (SOLID BURN ON) however I also have to say that this is one of the few drives I’ve seen that was able to burn them nice !

IF the first guy plextor burner is 712 I completely understand his complaints !!

So far my Ricoh MBIL’s burned on my Philips burner show no degradation but I haven’t scanned all of them yet. Currently busy with it. Some of these are burned in late february so slightly older as the above and still in good shape.

Example serial of my batch: 5228 555 +R C A 04089
Storrage condition: cheap disc wallet.

#16

Well if your drive doesn’t come with SOLID BURN I would vote for return.
Don’t know what’s going on but so far only drives with SOLID BURN have been able to burn these nice in my case !
Might see if Benq/Philips firmware support was just allready that good or is it SOLID BURN that did the job.
I allways leave SOLID BURN on. So it might be that Benq/Philips did there homework much better as the competition and I didn’t notice it.
With the next MBIL burn I will leave it off and see if I can create something coaster worthy like I get with most other drives !

#17

:doh: :doh: :doh:
I forgot this important piece of information! Thanks for the heads-up!
Here: 5237 564 +R C B 11025
(Hi Dakhaas :wink: )

#18

I have Solidburn (I use several 1650 burners) but I prefer to be on the safer side and keep on using my usual discs. :cool:

#19

Then again with SOLID BURN on my Philips does burn these MBIL RICOH’s really nice.
And as I use at least 2 (and in most cases 3) different disc’s it’s still a good option for me.
But I probably won’t buy them again because of there being better options available for the price.

#20

Not to take your thread too far OT, Franck - but I decided to burn a disc that I had stored in a spindle, in a dark closet, with the plan of testing it for further deterioration a few months from now.

Boy did I get a shock.

Imation-branded MBIPG101 R04, freshly burned and scanned on a LiteOn 1635S (YV6N), with SB = on, Force HT = on, OS = off. Burned with ImgBurn 1.3.0.0.

Guess my Litey doesn’t like them :sad:…I shall burn another on my 1650 to check it isn’t the discs:

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