Verbatim DVD+R 16x (MCC004) all unreadable... help?

vbimport

#1

I’m quite new to all of this, but very recently I discovered that, I believe, a 50 pack of Verbatim DVD+R 16x I bough just around half a year ago are now right around unreadable. My burns around March cannot be recognized by my computer, and now burns the beginning of May are very “spotty”, as in my computer can read them 20% of the time I insert them in.

Browsing this forum I see very technical images and graphs, but for all I know all of my Verbatims have gone to waste. Is there a possible explanation for this? I burnt some Maxells the same time as the Verbatims and they read just fine now. I’m just baffled (and disgusted) at such a quick degradation from such a well known brand.

My conclusion is that I can’t trust Verbatim anymore. :frowning:

Does anyone else share similar experiences or is this a stroke of bad luck?


#2

How have you stored your disks? What speed did you burn them at? What make was the burner you burnt them with?


#3

Stored in 50 pack spindle. In a closet I store all of my VHSs in as well.

I have a Pioneer DVD-RW DVR-107D burner with the most updated firmware, 1.22

All burnt at 4x.


#4

I’m just beginning to think that I got a bad batch. Which is very frustrating because the deterioration of these discs were faster than fast.


#5

hmm… this is too low a speed for 16x media. You should have burnt at at least 8x. However it shouldnt have degraded.

You probably got a bad batch, it happens from time to time, have you got any other verbatims from another batch you have burnt before (or after) that time?


#6

I am actually unsure if I did buy another 50 pack the same time. I’m in the process of testing all of my DVDs (which are a lot and a tedious task), and when I do get through them all, I will know for sure. So far, about 90% of my Verbatims are unreadable. I may have to back them up quickly if this trend continues.

It is still very disappointing to know that you cannot trust a brand anymore because of “bad batches”. If anything, it should be reliable. =\


#7

That is why you should do a quality scan after your burns. Thia will tell you how well the burn went, and if you should re-burn. Unfortunately you said you have a pioneer, which are unreliable scanners. Have you bought any new burners since?


#8

No, this Pioneer is my only DVD burner. I had no idea about quality testing. So far a short compilation of a few of my DVDs are organized here. I hope to finish this table sometime tomorrow though.

Date2.doc (52 KB)


#9

MCC004 burnt @4X…? The original burning quality was probably not very good…that’s one strong possibility…

Also did you verify these discs, in a way or another, just after the burn? In different words, how can you be sure it’s degradation?

Where do you live and where did you buy these discs? In Europe we have fake Verbatim products. And you can buy discs that have already ‘degraded’ as blanks, if they have been stored very poorly or were subjected to bad conditions during transport…

Could you post the serial at the inner hub, and the stampercode (hub area, recording side - you’ll need a strong artificial light to see it) ?


#10

By verify, no, I did not technically verify the discs. The only thing I did was play the DVD from my drive right after it burned to see if it worked. And it always does before I store it away.

I live in Houston, TX. I understand we have high humidity, but that doesn’t account for why only my Verbatim discs are unreadable whereas my Maxell discs in the same spindle are fine. I store them in a closet where I store my old VHS tapes. I bought these discs from a well known chain store, Office Max. I don’t think they will sell faulty products.

One of the faulty Verbatims’s serial and stampercode:

PAPA23JG15204947 4

ZD2632-DVR-T47D

I’ve heard of the various possibilities of unreadable DVDs, varying from burning with things running in the background, non updated firmware, burner compatibility issues, etc. However, that does not solve the problem of why only my Verbatim DVDs are faulty and my Maxells are fine, even when burnt back to back or on the same day.


#11

Your discs are genuine MCC Verbatim (stampercode). Looks like a “made by Prodisc” serial to me but I’m not sure, I’m kinda new to these “serials” thing. [B]Karangunni[/B], [B]Dakhaas[/B], [B]OC-Freak[/B], [B]Francksoy [/B], [B]kg_evilboy[/B] or [B][Buck][/B] can tell for sure if these are made at Prodisc or at CMC. The only thing I4m sure of is they are not from MBI (India) as these have a “-R” or a “+R” in the middle of the serial.

In a way, it does. You have to realise that the media is only one variable in the equation. The burner/firmware will “like” one type of media at a given speed, not necessarily a different one. Are your Maxell discs 16X rated? Are they +R? -R? etc… so you’re probably comparing pears and apples.

As:

  • you’ve burnt 16X +R discs @4X, and MCC004 is not well knowned for (low) speed compatiblity :disagree: (as most +R 16X media BTW, -R 16X is more easy to burn at slow speeds);
    *there are not much reports of how well they burn in the 107D, that is quite an old burner, and certainly not how they burn @4X as no one on this board would burn them under @8X.
  • This is the first complaint of fast degradation with MCC004 that I see on the net…

You can’t just conclude that your Verbatim discs are unstable “because they are Verbatim”.

I bought these discs from a well known chain store, Office Max. I don’t think they will sell faulty products.
:confused: Uh? How would they come to know that they are faulty to start with?

Whatever. [B]Verbatim has a lifetime warranty[/B], so you’d better complaint to them as fast as possible, they should replace the discs. edit - unless it’s written somewhere on the package that they should be used in 16X burners only…


#12

They are CMC-made. Actually MCC004 IS known for being one of the few high speed media codes that often burns well at lower speeds, burning most media at 1/4 of its rated speed usually will give poor results but MCC is one exception. Having said that, that will not always be the case and if the burner has poor firmware support it isn’t going to matter what speed you burn them at, you can still have problems. In all likelyhood, you would get better results in your particular burner if you had burned them at 8x, so use that in the future with 16x media, or better yet, try using 8x or slower media or buy a 16x burner for 16x media. Considering the excellent results that most get with this media, I would first look at either poor initial burn quality - I would consider storage as an issue, but storing them in a spindle under fairly good conditions as you have rules that out for me (assuming labels were not used). If they were burned poorly initially, it won’t take much to go from seemingly troublefree to causing problems, such as even slight deterioration or weakening of a drive’s laser.

In addition, regarding your testing of your discs, you say that they are unreadable. Define ‘unreadable’ - does the drive even recognize/initialize the discs, or can the drive just not fully copy the discs? If the drive just cannot fully copy the discs, that could easily have been missed in simply playing back portions of the disc and then storing them away. Error levels creating unreadable portions of discs usually occurs near the edge of discs, areas that typically store extras/trailers/credits of DVDs and would easily be overlooked in a simple playback of a disc, therefore giving the false assumption that the initial burn was fine.


#13

:doh: We all forgot to ask about this…


#14

First report of degrading MCC004 that I’m coming across. :eek:

Degradation is always a possibility from a marginal batch (bad bonding…?) but I’d rather suspect, like others have mentioned, that the discs were burnt with poor quality in the first place.

@[B]scoobiedoobie[/B]: (hi there :slight_smile: ) - I personally found that MCC004 is far from being as speed tolerant as MCC03RG20. Maybe it depends on burners, but at least in my NEC drives they gave marginal burns @4X. Haven’t tested in my Benqs, though… :confused:

@[B]the original poster[/B]: would you happen to have paper sticky labels on these discs?..


#15

When did you update firmware on burner and what version were you using if you updated after burning those disks?
To test for transfer, use dvdd and lower read speed to 4x


#16

Interesting conclusion. You burn a 16x rated disc at 4x it turns out to be a bad burn, which like others here I believe is the most probably the cause of the problem, and you come to the conclusion Verbs can’t be trusted. Even with a bad batch I seriously doubt that they would degrade that quickly. I have never had a G05 degrade that quickly and and my 4x verbs are still readable now. Verbatim are second in reputation only to TY.

I’ll try a little experiment and post the results later with burning 16x Verbs both + and - in my BenQ and post the scans later. It will atleast add another drive to the equation and see if the marginal burns mentioned by Frank are drive dependant.

By the way you mentioned Maxells, what is the rated speed of those discs and what speed did you burn them at?

Santa they will only replace the discs if it is a problem with the discs and the problem is not caused by the user themselves. Taken from verbatims own site:

*** This media is compliant with the new standards for 16x DVD+R recording. However, using this media with the lower speed DVD+RW/+R drives that do not support higher speed recording speeds may result in writing errors, failures in retrieval of data, or damage to the data recorded on this media. Older drives might require a firmware upgrade, so please check with your drive manufacturer.

http://www2.verbatim-europe.com/index/product_view.php?menu1=product&menu2=152&menu3=58&lang_id=1&article_id=58
The same is there in the -R section too.

After a quick look at the pioneer site I have chaecked on the support of the 107 for 16x media and it does say that support for this speed of media is “unique to the drive” which if I am correct means some drives will support and some won’t. Not exactly a definative answer. Maybe contacting the manufacturer with the serial number of your drive will gat a much better answer than what I read.

Also I don’t think that because you are using the latest firmware will help I have just checked the date of that firmware and it says September 2004. Which is a long time ago and well before 16x cam out.
http://www.pioneer.eu/eur/content/support/support/software.html If others want to check to make sure I didn’t read it incorrectly.


#17

I have a Pioneer DVD-RW DVR-107D burner with the most updated firmware, [B]1.22[/B]

Last update: Sat Oct 01, 2005

http://forum.rpc1.org/dl_firmware.php?download_id=1754

when he upgraded firmware might be the pertinent issue?


#18

[B]This media is compliant with the new standards for 16x DVD+R recording. However, using this media with the lower speed DVD+RW/+R drives that do not support higher speed recording speeds may result in writing errors, failures in retrieval of data, or damage to the data recorded on this media[/B].

I think this pretty sums it up… :iagree:


#19

Yes but that is not on the official pioneer pages. Is that official firmware or modded? It is also why I put a link to the official page so others can check if they wanted, as I wouldn’t put it past me to have misread it after all it isn’t unknown for me to misread things sometimes :bigsmile:

THough I have to agree about when it was done.


#20

Okay, so I burnt this one at 4x on a BenQ1640 using BSLB firmware. I made it up of bits from all over the harddrive.