Using more-than-90-minute CD for audio-CD

vbimport

#1

Good evening,

I’m in ‘the recording crew’ of our symphonic orchestra, and we have a problem. The recordings of one of our concerts are 82 minutes long, just 2 minutes longer than the Red Book specs. I know there is no guarantee, but would a 90 minutes CD work in most drives, or is this doomed to fail? Should I play safe (and spend more money) by buying two discs and a double CD jewelcase?

Thanks in advance!


#2

90 minutes = 800 MB CD-R are out of spec. While most if not all recent computer drives can read them, I’m not so sure about standalones, especially picky ones. It might be better to split the recording in two, or even evaluating whether some disc type can be overburned to 82 mins.


#3

I would go with kg_evilboy’s 1st suggestion - split the recording over two discs. While you may have success overburning to an 80-min disc there’s no assurance that the end user will have hardware capable enough to read those overburned discs…


#4

[QUOTE=kg_evilboy;2519191]I’m not so sure about standalones, especially picky ones.[/QUOTE]

So I was wondering, anyone who has actually tried it on some players?


#5

Almost every player on the market can read 90min and even 99min CD-Rs just like normal ones.
Some old PC drives had issues with them, but I doubt you can find ANY standalone player nowadays who has problems playing them.


#6

…on another note, those 99-minute discs are pretty hard to find here in Asia. Those that I saw didn’t look reliable at all. Are there any good 99-minute discs being sold widely?


#7

Well, actually, I bought some to test, and I found out it has the same problems as normal CD-R’s, but about twice as bad. My 10 year old Sony ghettoblaster skips quite often (about every 30 seconds) while on normal CD-R’s, it skips seldom. I also tried my (over 20 years old) Technics CD-speler which plays it without problems and a pioneer car CD-player which also didn’t give any problems. I’ll keep on testing :slight_smile:

By the way, I bought Philips 800MB/90min CDs, so those discs are quite good I think?


#8

[QUOTE=ktf;2519365]By the way, I bought Philips 800MB/90min CDs, so those discs are quite good I think?[/QUOTE]

Where were they made? Taiwanese (made by Ritek) are usually better than Indian ones (made by MBIL).


#9

[QUOTE=pepst;2519692]Where were they made? Taiwanese (made by Ritek) are usually better than Indian ones (made by MBIL).[/QUOTE]I have seen a lot of Made in China Philips 800 MB CD-R, most likely Ritek too.
And there’s old stock Made in Germany CD-R too, which is most likely Primedisc.


#10

[QUOTE=pepst;2519692]Where were they made? Taiwanese (made by Ritek) are usually better than Indian ones (made by MBIL).[/QUOTE]

I haven’t checked CD-R manufacturers before, but I should check the ATIP? It is 96m43s37f, which I googled and this very same forum told me it is Primedisc, a Philips+Ritek.

But after all, I used a laptop burner, which is probably not as good as desktop burners. Should I burn these discs with a desktop burner if possible to get better results?


#11

[QUOTE=ktf;2519847]But after all, I used a laptop burner, which is probably not as good as desktop burners. Should I burn these discs with a desktop burner if possible to get better results?[/QUOTE]

Yup. Burn some on a decent desktop drive and see the difference… :eek: You’ll be amazed.


#12

[QUOTE=ktf;2519847]I haven’t checked CD-R manufacturers before, but I should check the ATIP? It is 96m43s37f, which I googled and this very same forum told me it is Primedisc, a Philips+Ritek.

But after all, I used a laptop burner, which is probably not as good as desktop burners. Should I burn these discs with a desktop burner if possible to get better results?[/QUOTE]

You were quite lucky to find the Primedisc made media as Primedisc went out of business a few years ago. In my humble opinion, they are the best 90+ min CD-Rs ever made.
Try to burn them with some desktop burner (even older CD-R burners should do the job) - the results most likely will be much better.


#13

[QUOTE=pepst;2519858]Try to burn them with some desktop burner (even older CD-R burners should do the job) - the results most likely will be much better.[/QUOTE]

Offtopic, but I’m just curious :wink: First of all, thanks for helping me.

I’ve searched backup for this claim, but I can’t find much about it. I can imagine slimline burners have worse burning quality because of their strict dimension guidelines, but I can’t find any facts. Is there anyone who knows why those drives are outperformed by normal ones? Better suspension (my drive quite often resonates when burning), better/faster aligning, better tracking?

Oh, and I was reading that topic about that very slow write speed are bad. How does this apply with laptop burners? Should I burn at 24x as that is half the speed of the media or is a bit lower probably better?

Oh, and please don’t tell me I should burn with a laptop burner at all, I will for these 90 minute CDs. :wink: Sometimes it’s just not possible or very inconvenient, as I have only a laptop, no desktop, and letting others burn it for me is not always possible.


#14

[QUOTE=pepst;2519858]You were quite lucky to find the Primedisc made media as Primedisc went out of business a few years ago. In my humble opinion, they are the best 90+ min CD-Rs ever made.[/QUOTE]

Well, I won’t buy my discs from the same shop, 10 euro for 10 discs :expressionless: I think I will order some Verbatim 90 min CDs, 25 for 8 euro, does anyone know wether these are any good? The protection layer is Extra Protection, not AZO, so are they produced at MCC of not? Anyone who has a suggestion?


#15

If you can afford it, I would recommend buying an external burner.
Laptop burners are slow clearly the burn quality is usually worse.

Old stock Verbatim 90 minute CD-R will be Ritek or CMC, recent will be made by Moser Baer India. I’m not too happy with MBI’s quality though.


#16

[QUOTE=kg_evilboy;2520031]I’m not too happy with MBI’s quality though.[/QUOTE]

So, which brand should I try then, if I can’t trust Verbatim for this job? I don’t think I can find Primediscs elsewhere, and 1 euro a disc is not within our budget :stuck_out_tongue: Normally I would buy Verbatims with AZO or Taiyo Yudens, but those are not available as 90 minute CDs


#17

A lot of 80 min CD-R can be overburned by a couple of minutes; I don’t remember, however, exactly how much Taiyo Yuden and Verbatim (Super)Azo CD-Rs can be overburned, but it might be possible.


#18

Usually it’s 60-90 seconds and maybe some might get almost to 120 seconds but that is to much of an over-burning for my taste.


#19

[QUOTE=ktf;2520002]Oh, and I was reading that topic about that very slow write speed are bad. How does this apply with laptop burners? Should I burn at 24x as that is half the speed of the media or is a bit lower probably better?[/QUOTE] Laptop burners cannot burn CD-R media faster than 24x, and this is only achieved near the end of the burn (the outer edge of the disc). When burning an Audio CD, it can be important to minimize jitter, and this is usually achieved with a constant linear velocity (CLV) burn, which can be no faster than 10x on a laptop drive.

I would try burning at 10x if that’s a selectable speed or else burn at 8x with a laptop drive.

A desktop drive will probably produce a better result, however, and 16x is usually optimal for burning Audio CDs on most desktop burners.


#20

81:45 is the maximum that I achieved, it was in 2002. with SmartBuy 32x CD-R 700MB, and Samsung SW-216B burner. Disc was pefectly readable in standalones in the club where I worked at that time (Philips, and Harman Kardon CD player, manufactured before 2000.)