SK Hynix invests in NAND with opening of Taiwanese R&D center

DoMiN8ToR 2013-10-16 10:14:20 UTC #1

We've just posted the following news: SK Hynix invests in NAND with opening of Taiwanese R&D center[newsimage]http://static.myce.com//images_posts/2013/09/myce-sk-hynix-logo-95x75.jpg[/newsimage]

South Korean company SK Hynix announced today it will increase its investments in NAND flash memory.

            Read the full article here: [http://www.myce.com/news/sk-hynix-invests-in-nand-with-opening-of-taiwanese-rd-center-69186/](http://www.myce.com/news/sk-hynix-invests-in-nand-with-opening-of-taiwanese-rd-center-69186/)

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Kenshin 2013-10-16 23:00:42 UTC #2

I’m not sure how many bytes SK-hynix now produces, but it was not one of the three largest NAND manufacturers a few years ago. They were Samsung, Toshiba, and Intel-Micron. Sometime earlier, AMD was there as well, but AMD was already overstreched by then.

This blog has no information on the new Taiwanese facility, but some will find interesting.

http://blog.skhynix.com/m/post/view/id/55

SK-hynix reached around 30% world DRAM marketshare, largely thanks to the new Wusi plant which, just before the fire, accounted for about 15%.

Here’s an EE Times report on the world NAND marketshare between 2012 and 2013: http://www.eetimes.com/document.asp?doc_id=1280394

In 4Q12 the ranking order was: Samsung, Toshiba, SK Hynix, Micron and Intel. Samsung retained first place with a revenue of $2,054 million, about 38.7 percent market share; Toshiba sold $1,466 million or 27.6 percent of the market; SK Hynix is third with $673 million, 12.7 percent of the market; Micron slipped to fourth with $655 million, 12.3 percent of the market; Intel is fifth with 455 million, 8.6 percent of the market.

For the whole of 2012 the order was Samsung, Toshiba, Micron, SK Hynix and Intel. Samsung, Micron and Intel grew market share compared with 2011 at the expense of Toshiba and SK Hynix.

Samsung’s 2012 NAND flash sales were $7,286 million, about 38.2 percent market share; Toshiba sold $5,322 million for 27.9 percent of the market; Micron with $2,648 million of annual NAND flash sales captured 13.9 percent of the market; SK Hynix is fourth with $2,261 million and 11.9 percent of the market; Intel is fifth with 1,545 million, 8.1 percent of the market.

Combined marketshare of Intel-Micron is larger than that of SK-hynix which makes the latter 4th with just a little more than 10% marketshare.

And for DRAM: http://www.dramexchange.com/WeeklyResearch/Post/2/3472.html

The Chinese mainland map says Beijing in the north, Wuxi and Shanghai in the southeastern coastal area though Wuxi itself is hundreds of kilometers away from the Yellow Sea. The next image shows inside of Wuxi SK-hynix plant.

Wischmop 2013-10-21 10:27:36 UTC #3

Are there any SSDs out there with this NAND? I only had SSDs with Intel, Toshiba and Samsung-NAND.

Kenshin 2013-10-21 19:37:12 UTC #4

Of course, there are a lot. I saw some drives with Hynix NAND chips from some reviews though I can’t recall any at the moment. Many of those chips are also used in “eMMC” solutions employed in smartphones, and tablets, iPod, wearables like Galaxy Gear, USB memory sticks, automobile blackboxes, HDTVs, eBook readers, standalone consumer products, etc.

Wischmop 2013-10-23 08:52:51 UTC #5

Hope you will remember

I have more than 10 SSDs (Intel, Plextor, Corsair, Kingston, Sandisk, Toshiba, Crucial) and IÂ´m sure no one have Hynix

Kenshin 2013-10-23 14:46:30 UTC #6

[QUOTE=Wischmop;2705748]Hope you will remember

I have more than 10 SSDs (Intel, Plextor, Corsair, Kingston, Sandisk, Toshiba, Crucial) and IÂ´m sure no one have Hynix[/QUOTE]

But that is not many.

Wischmop 2013-10-24 12:17:52 UTC #7

It is

And there are all different models, nver was a guy who buy always the same brands/models

Kenshin 2013-10-25 03:22:41 UTC #8

[QUOTE=Wischmop;2705956]It is

And there are all different models, nver was a guy who buy always the same brands/models[/QUOTE]

There are at least hundreds of brand names.

Wischmop 2013-10-26 05:34:43 UTC #9

And most I have seen use Toshiba-NANDs.

I take often a look at reviews with SSDs that are avaible in Germany, canÂ´t remember one with Hynix-NANDs

Kenshin 2013-10-26 06:15:07 UTC #10

[QUOTE=Wischmop;2706158]And most I have seen use Toshiba-NANDs.

I take often a look at reviews with SSDs that are avaible in Germany, canÂ´t remember one with Hynix-NANDs[/QUOTE]

That’s easy to explain. South Korean SSD manufacturers prefer Samsung chips. US SSD manufacturers prefer Intel-Micron chips. What you said by “most” cannot possibly be most. Try to find all the names of SSD brands, reviewed or not. There’s at least one existing thread for that purpose.

Toshiba’s NAND quality has been clearly far superior to that of Hynix, which suffered from years of massive identity crisis and wasn’t sufficiently independent to decide on large-scale new investment into NAND production as Samsung was. AMD was once the world’s No. 1 or No. 2 NAND producer. There’s no AMD on any list now.

It is very recent Hynix began NAND production in mass quantity that can be compared to players like Micron.

Members who frequently visit websites like this read reviews written by early adopters, power users, enthusiats, or at least by those who test products aware that many of the readers would like to see reviews from their points of view, not the average consumer’s. It’s natural people who most frequently and most aggressively post here to buy OCZ’s and Plextor’s and Corsair’s for SSD, and Pioneer and Plexfor for Blu-ray. Hynix has not only been late, it has been producing mostly lower-quality chips.

By the way, what I said about SK-hynix’s marketshare was about this:

It’s not. And NAND is not only used in retail SSD products. Retail SSD products account for only a very tiny percentage of the total, and its share is almost negligible compared to SSD shipped to OEM. SSDs used in desktop PC today may seem a lot, but it’s still a tiny percentage of the whole compared to HDDs. NAND has been used in memory cards like CF and microSD, USB sticks, eMMC as used in smartphones and tablets, cars, watches, TVs, just about everything. NAND used in USB sticks and smartphones require far less up-to-date performance.

Wischmop 2013-10-30 12:53:05 UTC #11

Well, Samsung-NAND in non-Samsung-SSDs are rare here. Maybe it was often to see some years ago, but now Toshiba and Micron are the standard for SSDs from third partys.

OK, there are many “manufacturers”, but brands like Corsair, Sandisk, Plextor, Kingston, OCZ are the ones who sell here much. And they mostly use Toshiba.

And if you say that Toshiba is much better than Hynix I donÂ´t see a reason to buy a SSD with Hynix-NAND

Kenshin 2013-10-30 13:52:37 UTC #12

[QUOTE=Wischmop;2706812]Well, Samsung-NAND in non-Samsung-SSDs are rare here. Maybe it was often to see some years ago, but now Toshiba and Micron are the standard for SSDs from third partys.

OK, there are many “manufacturers”, but brands like Corsair, Sandisk, Plextor, Kingston, OCZ are the ones who sell here much. And they mostly use Toshiba.

And if you say that Toshiba is much better than Hynix I donÂ´t see a reason to buy a SSD with Hynix-NAND[/QUOTE]

You sound very much confused.

Samsung makes NAND. A lot of it.
Samsung NAND is used mostly in non-Samsung devices. Most Samsung SSDs are used in non-Samsung products (under Apple brand names, for example.)
Samsung has 30% of NAND share. SK-hynix has 10% of NAND share.
There have been hundreds to thousands of “brands” of SSD products.
A brand does not necessarily make something. It’s just a brand. NAME.
Brand names like OCZ and Plextor have nothing to do with production or design or development. How much each of the brand owners contributes to the overall development and marketing of SSD products is little known, but it’s safe to assume most of the brand names you are quite familiar are not manufacturers or developers. Being Plextor in SSD isn’t quite the same as being Coca-cola in beverage.
They are all small brand names in SSD except Intel and Toshiba.
Toshiba is the original inventor of NAND. SK-hynix is late and small (compared to Toshiba and Samsung.) That does not mean SK-hynix will not be able to make better NAND in the coming years. At the moment, it is behind Samsung in both NAND and DRAM, and I am skeptical of SK’s leadership.

Making SSD is cheaper than making HDD. That does not mean it is always easy or any company can make good SSD by investing US$100,000 overnight. Making NAND is far more expensive than making HDD. Most of the cost of making SSD is the cost of NAND. Being Plextor or Apple does not make one superior SSD brand name. It just sounds good though it is possible an Apple SSD can outperform a competitor’s by about 5% (at 2x or 5x the cost.) At least, Apple tries to buy better parts at lower cost from competitors, so it’s safe for consumers to buy Apple SSD as long as the price is acceptable.

Wischmop 2013-11-02 12:28:52 UTC #13

NO, IÂ´m not confused

ItÂ´s fact that in Germany you will find very rare a SSD which is not from Samsung but uses Samsung-NAND.
Apple used Samsung in past (now they use Sandisk, which means Toshiba-NAND). But in normal online-shops you will not find any Apple-branded-SSD.

Like I said, I read very often SSD-reviews and still I canÂ´t say that in the last 2 years there were one SSD with Samsung (except Samsung-SSD) or SK-Hynix-NAND

I never said that Plextor or OCZ make/develope own NAND.

IF I remember it right, you are live in South Korea? Maybe itÂ´s completely different there with SSDs, what I wrote is the situation in Germany

Confusing for you ?

Wischmop 2013-11-02 16:17:03 UTC #14

Ups, I dunno that I can comment the news in the forum, I donÂ´t saw that you for sure from South Korea

Kenshin 2013-11-02 21:44:03 UTC #15

[QUOTE=Wischmop;2707246]NO, IÂ´m not confused

Like I said, I read very often SSD-reviews and still I canÂ´t say that in the last 2 years there were one SSD with Samsung (except Samsung-SSD) or SK-Hynix-NAND

I never said that Plextor or OCZ make/develope own NAND.

IF I remember it right, you are live in South Korea? Maybe itÂ´s completely different there with SSDs, what I wrote is the situation in Germany

Confusing for you ?[/QUOTE]

Look at this data:

You can do some more research on SSDs sold in Germany. Most reviews are not really helpful in discussing such matters as they serve only certain purposes. It’s right I live in South Korea, but I’ve been quite familiar with market situations in several Western European countries.

Kenshin 2013-11-02 22:02:20 UTC #16

By the way, I can say SK-hynix has recently started developing their own SSDs, perhaps not as earnestly as Samsung yet. Hynix increased investment into NAND production and is right now vastly expanding job posts (headquarter at Gyeonggi Province, South Korea) related to SSD development. Attached is one of those advertisements.

Wischmop 2013-11-03 07:50:07 UTC #17

[QUOTE=Kenshin;2707282] It’s right I live in South Korea, but I’ve been quite familiar with market situations in several Western European countries.[/QUOTE]

Still donÂ´t find one SSD with Hynix or Samsung-NAND

Like I wrote, I read many SSD-reviews from here and some other countries, at least reviews of SSD-brands sold here.

I only believe you familar with the market here if you can name some brands/models with the requested NAND

Wischmop 2013-12-03 11:07:59 UTC #18

Hah, finally I find one with Hynix

IÂ´m surprised, thought it use Tosh-NAND like the other Neutrons

That means I have a Hynix-SSD since 5 months

Kenshin 2013-12-04 02:57:59 UTC #19

[QUOTE=Wischmop;2711735]Hah, finally I find one with Hynix

IÂ´m surprised, thought it use Tosh-NAND like the other Neutrons

That means I have a Hynix-SSD since 5 months [/QUOTE]

You see, Corsair switched the NAND source from IMFT of Intel and Micron, both US NAND manufacturers, to SK-hynix just around the time SK-hynix was slowly recovering from years of massive identity crisis and gaining global NAND market share. The present SK-hynix at first was largely the semiconductor (DRAM) business division of LG Electronics. The late Nobel Peace prizewinner DJ forced LG to give it up and it became part of Hyundai, another jaebol (family-based, hereditary, usually with hundreds of subsidaries) company competing against all other jaebols. Later it was transformed into Hynix. Hyundai itself went through quite a lot of crises including the suicide and homicide involving its owners and bosses and North Korea’s Kim Jungil (and the bombs). While Samsung made rapid growth in all those years, Hynix suffered from the shame of being the name always mentioned on the pages of The Register as to which of the leading semiconductor company could and would acquire it. It was a shame for all Hynix employees, but also one for all former LG employees, and one for the entire nation because semiconductor for the new generations of South Korea meant the key to survival as a nation. Finally, SK, a company that grew rich through petroleum and later further expanded through cellular-based telecommunication (mostly by selling Samsung phones at double and triple prices and charging impossible voice and SMS rates thanks to the fact the other competitor was KT, a national and public company, which allowed any pricing possible) announced the acquisition. So, the original Hynix was like the semiconductor business part of Samsung Electronics. The company that acquired Hynix is like the Latin American telecommunication empire of Carlos Slim Helu. The last part may not be easy to understand for 3G and LTE subscribers in the US where Verizon Wireless and AT&T actually LOSE US$200 for each iPhone they sell, but the exact opposite thing has happened in South Korea and most parts in Latin America: companies like SK and KT made US$200 profits for each iPhone they sold.

Wischmop 2013-12-04 10:18:30 UTC #20

Oops, taht is much info, I see I donÂ´t know the south Korea history good

So Hunix is now a brand of itÂ´s own?

AFAIK newer versions of Neutron GTX use 19nm Toshiba-NAND. The first Neutrons used not IMFT, it use(d) Toshiba 24nm-NAND

LAMD is in the hand of Hynix, maybe future SSDs with LAMD only have the choice of combination with Hynix-NAND.

Neutron-series are not the best sold in Germany (donÂ´t know the situation in USA or Asia), but it have a good reputation and 5-year-warranty

So Corsair use still the Neutron-name, it still use LAMD.

I like my Neutron, itÂ´s fast and works even in my older notebook very well.

But Corsair is on the wrong way, I dunno whether I buy in some years still from this brand.

In the past they had very good PSUs, some with very good Seasonic-design and not so bad from CWT.

Now the PSUs donÂ´t fall in price but in quality. Cheap caps on the secondary, medicro and more worse PSU made by CWT. The CS-series uses Great Wall, a not so known brand which can make good PSUs but only if the re-labeler pay for it. Good technology, but also cheap caps on secondary.