Scanning CDRs - which drive?

I chose to put this in the main Blank Media forum (as opposed to the CDR/RW scanning one), since more people, who know more about scanning than I do, would see it. :slight_smile:

I have two sets of backup CDRs…which drive should I scan them on - my LiteOn 1693, or a Sony CRX230EE (which is in another PC)? I know burning CDRs on a DVD burner isn’t really the best idea, but since I have no room for a CD-RW along with my burners, I haven’t got much choice!

I did some scans, burns etc on both drives, and to be honest, the results from the Sony scans are pretty scary. I can live with some errors (loads of C1, for example), but when C2s start appearing, it makes me wonder.

Any advice would be much appreciated, as these are my backup discs - I want them to last for awhile at least! :slight_smile:

I’m really sorry if this seems like a stupid question :flower:

^Scan on the Sony. Dunno if this is fixed, but the earlier L-O DVDRWs had a scanning bug on CDR discs, where a single green spike used to show up on a KProbe scan.

CD scanning is very consistent among my drives (Nec, Benq, Pioneer…) so I actually thought its wasn’t an issue. :confused:

I’m interested in what people will input here. :iagree:

As I already told you in another thread, the LiteOn DVD burners are not reliable CD scanners, because they are far too optimistic about C1/C2 errors.

Having seen your scan performed with a Sony CRX230EE drive in this post, I also wouldn’t trust that drive as a scanner.

My advice to you if you want a reliable CD scanner is, to either get a dedicated LiteOn CD-RW drive (not combo or DVD-RW) or one of the following DVD burners: NEC 355x/455x, Plextor PX-716/755 or BenQ 1655/1650/1640.

You can put your new drive in an external USB/FireWire enclosure if you don’t have enough room inside your pc.

If somebody twisted my arm and forced me to choose between the two drives you already have, I would choose the LiteOn 1693S. But please don’t twist my arm like that!

Arachne, if you have sufficient interest in seeing comparative CD-R scans between some drives I have access to, I can post some scans in this thread.

I don’t know if he is interested (thoug I doubt he isn’t :bigsmile: ) But I am for sure! :iagree:

She. And yes, I would be interested, DrageMester, thanks. Yeah, I read what you said about LiteOn DVD burners as CD scanners, and although I believe you, I was greedy for more opinions :bigsmile: (more people seem to browse the main media forum, as I said!). I’m pleased that you too wouldn’t trust the Sony as a scanner!

LOL, I won’t twist your arm about the LiteOn, I’ll look into getting one of the drives you suggested, and put it into an enclosure (or into the other PC, although I’ll have to save up any scans I need doing, as I only use it once a week).

Look forward to seeing some scans! :slight_smile:

OK, CD-R scans it is then.

The following scans are of a “C2 Test CD” I made in an unscientific but easy way by taking an excellent quality CD and drawing a black radial line on the CD starting at about 5mm from the inner edge and getting thicker all the way to the outer edge. Any drive that doesn’t report C2 errors when scanning this disc is clearly not reporting correctly!

First I show you scans at the most reliable and meaningful speed in each scanning drive. This is not the same speed in every drive!

[ol]
[li]LiteOn SHW-1635S scanned at 32x (CAV)[/li][li]NEC ND-4551A scanned at 16x (CLV)[/li][li]Plextor PX-712A scanned at 32x (CAV)[/li][/ol]The LiteOn drive wil actually scan this disc at some speeds (12x and 48x) without reporting a single C2 error, which clearly isn’t believable. Using 32x seems to be the best speed for this particular drive.

The Plextor drive is a little picky compared to some other PX-712A drives I have seen, and it usually reports more C1 errors than other drives and sometimes even C2 errors that other drives don’t see. But I still consider it to be my most trusted drive for C1/C2/CU scanning. This drive is also the only drive I own that reports CU errors. The drive is usually very consistent in reporting C1/C2/Cu at different speeds, except that really bad discs show more erros at 48x, and a few discs show elevated C1 level in the very beginning of 24x scans (ironic that this is the default scanning speed in PlexTools).

The NEC 4551 drive reports random C1 spikes at some speeds on some discs, but this behaviour is minimized by scanning at the 8x or 16x CLV speeds; the results are the same but 16x only takes half as long to perform.

Here’s another set of scans using another disc.

The disc was burned at 52x on a LiteOn SOHR-5238S CD-RW drive, and it is not a particularly good burn due to the high speed. Some scanners show high C1 levels or even C2 errors while other drives like the disc better.

The LiteOn 1635S burner is ridiculously optimistic about this burn, showing no C2 errors and an average C1 rate of only 0.11. This is a strong example of why I don’t recommend using LiteOn DVD burners for scanning CDs!

The NEC 4551 drive shows C2 errors on some scans and no C2 errors on other scans.

The Plextor PX-712 drive (scans will be in the following post) also sometimes shows C2 and at other times show no C2 errors. I believe this is because the burn is of marginal quality.

[ol]
[li]BenQ DW1620 Pro scanned at 40x (CAV)[/li][li]LiteOn SOHR-5238S scanned at 40x (CAV)[/li][li]LiteOn SHW-1635S scanned at 32x (CAV)[/li][li]NEC ND-4551A scanned at 16x (CLV) Scan showing no C2 errors[/li][li]NEC ND-4551A scanned at 16x (CLV) Scan showing some C2 errors[/li][/ol]

Same disc as above scanned in Plextor PX-712A drive at 32x.

Whoa, I can see your point about the Liteys being optimistic when scanning CDRs. Definitely interesting stuff, all of it.

I know where I can pick up a LiteOn one, but I guess it’ll have to wait - my mother’s birthday has just about cleaned me out, LOL.

Edit: I’ll take a look at the last scans you just posted, tomorrow - been out tonight, and I’m a little worse for wear :wink:

Thanks for taking the time to post them, and feed my curiosity. :bigsmile:

Here’s yet another disc scanned in different drives. The quality is very good or excellent, depending on which drive you ask.

Yet again the scan result in the LiteOn DVD burner is just too good to be true.

[ol]
[li]LiteOn SHW-1635S scanned at 32x (CAV)[/li][li]NEC ND-4551A scanned at 32x (CAV)[/li][li]Plextor PX-712 scanned at 32x (CAV)[/li][/ol]

I have plenty of other CD-R scans available, but only a few more from the BenQ DW1620 and LiteOn SOHR-5238S since they are not my own drives.

The drives I have constantly available can bee seen in my signature.

I’m not posting anymore scans in this thread unless somebody asks to see something in particular.

I’m very sorry :flower:

@DrageMester: thanks. :slight_smile: - I’ll do the same with my own drives. A Pity we can’t scan the very same discs :bigsmile:

No problem, Francksoy :)…thanks again for posting those scans, DrageMester - until you mentioned it in that other thread, I had no idea that CDR scans could vary so much from drive to drive (although obviously there’s gonna be some variation, since I believe scanning is a reflection of how a particular drive deals with errors etc), with LiteOn DVD drives being the most tolerant, from what I can see.

BTW, a little clarification - I started a new thread on this for the reasons stated above, but also - I didn’t want to hijack a thread that was meant for scanning TY CDRs only. :slight_smile:

the Sony CRX230EE is a Liteon 5239S.

Should be fine for scanning.

First CDR: an OK disc (was burnt in a Pioneer 109).

Great consistency among the three drives. :slight_smile: - only the 4550 is slightly more forgiving with C1.

A bad disc (with C2 errors) will follow soon.



Nice one, Francksoy, thanks for those! I may not say much about it (the more I say, the more ignorant I sound :bigsmile: ), but I’m finding all of this very interesting - since I’m still learning with all of this, it’s really very helpful. :wink:

@DarthBoy

Yeah, I found a thread about the Sony, and what LiteOn model it was, when I did a search (before I started this thread). I was gonna have a go at crossflashing it, but since the drive isn’t in my primary PC, I couldn’t be bothered. :bigsmile:

Personally, I wouldn’t use any DVD drive for CD scanning. But I also wouldn’t use them for CD burning. For what it’s worth, here’s a set of scans of the same audio CD on TY CDR in 3 drives. Draw your own conclusions.

IMHO that depends entirely on the drives in question.

Some DVD burners burn CD-R with higher quality than some CD burners.
So if you want to burn CDs with better quality than what you can get in the best DVD burners, you will probably be limited in your choice of CD burner!

Also if you don’t have a lot of free drive bays in your pc, having a dedicated CD burner may not be an acceptable choice. It all depends…

Me neither. Er. Wouldn’t HAVE used one for CD burning (but I kept on testing), until I found, to my surprise, my NEC 3540A really outstanding for CDR burning :cool:

About your scans: considering the consistency I have with my own drives, I’m extremely susprised that there can be so MUCH discrepancies among drives. I guess that what I experience is then atypic and relies 100% on chance. :eek: - funny.