Samsung (BeAll) or Ridisc (Ritek G04)?

Well, I am going to buy a NEC recorder (2500A probably) but
I am having trouble choosing the blank media.
At first, I was going to buy Princo.
Then, I was recommended Ridisc’s.
So, yesterday’s evening, I placed my web-order and purchased 100 Ridiscs for 0,6€ each.
But I have spent all this night reading this forum and discovered that there is potential trouble between 2500A and Ritek G04 disks.

Now my attention has shifted towards Samsung media (BeAll).
People seems happy with BeAll in this forum.
It is a bit more expensive than Ridisc.
Should I get the BeAll?

I am now quickly going to try to cancel my order, and I will take some time to meditate…
oh, I need some sleep too :a

Hi!

RiTEK G04 should work fine when you burn them @4x only. If you want to go for higher speeds, you’ll have to control every medias readability, because RiTEK G04 discs are known to vary in quality.
Samsungs discs (BeAll) are more stable, but I don’t know how they behave burned above 4x.

oh, well, the shop mailed me saying that changes are not possible
and they are sending me the 100 Ridiscs. grrrr…

well, I still can purchase the Pioneer 107 instead of the NEC 2500
but according to what I have read, the 2500 has better overall writting
quality.
what do I do?

Some people even say that Princos behave better than the Riteks
in the ND2500 is that true?

well, I guess I am going to pay the “Newbie error”.

@Legnerp:
that is not a problem, because I will burn the Riteks at spec, 4x.
Maybe I burn them at 2x…??

I don’t think that burning @2x will still improve the quality. Most burns @4x on RiTEK G04 and G05 are very good with every firmware for the NEC, don’t worry. :wink: In addition, RiDisc are known to be some of the “better” G04.

PRINCO? :confused:
:Z

The advantage against the Pioneer is the ability to write DL discs, as you can flash the 2500A with 2510A firmwares and then have a 2510A (although the 2510A isn’t much more expensive these days). The great firmware support in these forums is also a reason to buy the NEC! :slight_smile:

@Legnerp:
burning at 2X can be even worse, yes, I have seen in other thread.
I am in the process of learning :stuck_out_tongue:

Re. Princo, (the white ones), I have seen a surprising amount of 2500A happy users.
Well, I guess I will have to find out for myself. A 10 unit cakebox is pretty cheap. So there is no reason not to try these.

Regarding dual layer, I am not interested at all. Media is ridiculously expensive, and even if price drops to $1, the fact that the speed is limited to 2,5X means that quality will be bad. Just imagine, if there are problems with SL Riteks, I imagine with DL media problems will be far worse.

I have found a shop that sells the Pioneer 107 for 76 euros, same as NEC 2500A.

I am even thinking on purchasing BOTH. It would be very interesting for testing purposes. But my money is soooo limited :sad:
Donations please :stuck_out_tongue:

OK, try them on your own. Normally 3 to 5 out of 10 work OK, the rest comes out as crap! They vary in quality as hell!

The limited speed for DL discs is depending on the laser power. A laser, that can burn SL discs up to 8x is only able to burn DL @2,4x. Lasers for 16x SL should be able to burn DL @4x. But as long as the media is not constructed for this and as long as it is so expensive, DL is IMO worth for testing purposes only…

Yeah, please give us a posting with a detailled comparison! BTW, is the Pioneer able to do bitsetting?

  1. If you think of buying 2 drive for testing purpose… Lite-On could be a good candidate. Recent threads suggest that Kprobe is less reliable than it was regarded. But it would be fun to have it.

  2. Even if you pick up a bad batch, burning G04 at 4x should be fine (and having 107 won’t help much to improve such bad discs). A good batch will endure 8x burning, it’s just your luck.

  3. Probably you’re mentioning Beall -R discs. But just in case… I bought a few Samsung branded Beall +R 4x rated discs. And they were very good. I actually prefer them at 8x burning(updated at herrie v2b5, so you need it) over my Ridata G04. But Beall were more expensive.

RICOHJPNR01 DVD+R from Ridata is the best for NEC ND-2500A so far… as I experienced without forgetting the cost per disc as well. I haven’t encountered any coaster with this media… GOOD STUFF!!!

@Legnerp:
regarding bitsetting, well, I want the recorder primarily for backing up data (audio and video), so the bitsetting is not important to me. And, well, I don’t know much about bitsetting, but I guess if you use DVD-R discs, you don’t need bitsetting, am I right?

I don’t think I have the money to buy both drives now… but later, maybe.

I have seen that Verbatim 4X media is now at 80 euros/100 units. Probably Mitsubishi Chemicals. Maybe I buy these and compare with the Ridiscs. Then, if Ridiscs are bad, I return the unused cakeboxes.

One question. I don’t have a LiteOn DVD burner, but I have the LTD-163D DVD reader.
May I use Kprobe with the LTD-163D to compare, e.g, the Ridisc and the Verbatim, recorded, eg, with the ND2500?

@jk736:
-A LiteOn too? then that’s 3 drives!!! lol
No, I am restricted to NEC and Pioneer, because according to the reviews, they have the best writting quality. Anyway, I like the LiteOn’s because they traditionally work very well with speed-controlling programs, like CD_Bremse.
-I hope my Ridiscs are good enough. I live in Spain, and ordered them to Germany.
Returning them will be costly.
-Yes, well, BeAll -R or +R, they cost the same, a bit more than the Ridiscs. Also, with luck, I will get TY-Samsungs instead of BeAll-Samsungs. I wish I could order to Newegg.

@mudenk:
I have not investigated Ridatas… I don’t see them in the shops I have looked at.

thanks to all for the help :slight_smile:

Newegg has one… that’s where I bought mine. Seems that the DVD blank media’s price is going down and down… I wonder could it be free after rebate like CD-R in the future?

@arga2k:

You’re right. There is no bitsetting for DVD-R(W) (although some companies fake it for DVD-R). Bitsetting is only for compatibility issues with DVD+R(W) on older stand-alones.
Verbatim 4x media is very good and has constant quality. Some users reported the Verbatim DVD+R 8x (MCC 003) to be weak, the Verbatim DVD-R 8x (MCC 02RG20) is also very good.
You can use either KProbe or CD-DVD Speed with your drive. But it only tells you how well the disc can be read on this drive, nothing more! In addition you can record reading curves (Tranfer rate test in CD-DVD Speed) with a speedhacked firmware (up to 16x) from the Codeguys (http://codeguys.rpc1.org). If there are no serious slow downs, the disc should read fine in many drives and stand alones.

@Mudenk:
thats more or less what I have payed for my Ridiscs 0,6€/disc.
I can’t order those Ridatas, because I live in Spain, and NewEgg doesn’t accept int. orders. A shame.
The customer reviews are good for those Ridatas.
I see, that they are R+, and this is why they are manufactured by Ricoh, not Ritek,
and this is why quality is probably superior. aaaahhhh :slight_smile:
I will pay attention, maybe I can find them here.

Well, anyway, if If I could, I would get the TY-Samsungs at NewEgg.
Anyone knows if these TY-Samsungs can be purchased in Europe?

@Legerp:
ok, then no problem about bitsetting.
Regarding Verbatims, I have checked the 2500A and 107 Reviews.
I see there are 3 Mitsubishi types:
for +R: MCC 002, MCC 003
for -R: MCC01RG20

The MCC 003 is the weak one. No problem because I will buy the -R Verbatim.
The Yundens seems to be all of them good.
The RICOH dye seems quite acceptable too in +R discs. Comparable to BeAll.
And then, the Ritek dye and CMC, and then the Princos, etc.
Lets say, we can classify from better to worse:

  1. TAIYO YUNDEN
  2. Mitsubishi (MCC)
  3. Ricoh, BeAll
  4. Ritek
  5. CMC, Pricos, etc

more or less.
I want Yundens! :slight_smile:

Ok, I have downloaded the firmware for the LTD 163D. Will I be able to re-flash the original firmware?

ok, now I go to sleep. Last night I slept just 1 hour and need to recover. my eyes are quite red. hehe.

thanks for everything

Maxell and newer Prodisc dyes also should give acceptable results. In your MCC list you forgot my above mentioned MCC 02RG20, which is the newer 8x dye for -R. It is also very good (and very expensive :sad: ), I’ve already burned some! I’ve just had great results with MCC 01RG20 too, burned @6x with my modified TDK 1.34 firmware.
Not long ago, I bought Fujifilm DVD-R 8x (5 in JewelCase for 7,01 EUR), which are TYG02 (the most recent Taiyo Yuden dye) and the results are outstanding! :bigsmile: Highly recommended, but a bit expensive…

You can make a backup of your current firmware first, and later go back… You should use the recommended tool mentioned in the readme!

Yes, I noticed your MCC 02RG20, but this one wasn’t tested on the ND2500A nor Pioneer107 reviews, @cdfreaks. Probably, it wasn’t available at the time.
The MCC 01RG20 was tested @8X with excelent results.
http://www.cdfreaks.com/article/134/7

You got only 6X with your firmware? did you try 8X?

About the Fuji, I will pay attention in the shops, see if I can spot it. If the price drops, that one can be an option.

But I guess now I am going to get the Verbatims DVD-R MCC 01RG20.
The 10unit cakebox is really cheap at 0,80€ each (buying 10 cakeboxes). But there is something strange. My vendor says they are made in Taiwan, but according to cdfreaks 2500A review, the MCC01RG20 “Real Mitsubishi” is made in Singapore?

Some DVD drives reads +R discs faster if they are bitsetted. It is a bonus to the compatibility. I only use DVDs to backup data. My reader loves bitsetted +R. (reduces reading time by half)

If everything is same, I go for +R media. But as you know… the choice is not so simple. “A good -R disc” vs “a moderate +R disc” at the same price, such situations are more common. And… the choice is yours. MCC 01RG20 sounds very good. I’ll prefer it over one of my +R discs. (But then again, the price isn’t same. Life is always complicated. :slight_smile: )

@rj:
yes, you can bet, life is very complicated :slight_smile:
Recording media should be scored with a “quality score”, certified by a credible lab, so that the user can choose easily, instead of having to go to the internet and lose a lot of time investigating.
It is funny that software like “K-probe” is secret, and only a LiteOn leakage allowed it to go public. It seems that manufacturers like that the public remains ignorant.

reg. bitsetting, the +R discs read faster if bitsetted? ah, that is interesting.
which is faster: a DVD-R (non-bitsetted) or a bitsetted DVD+R?

BTW, it seems that the +R BeAll is better than the -R version, judging from the graphs in the 2500A review @cdfreaks
Allso, the BeAll disks don’t work very well with the Pioneer 107D.

Can anyone confirm this (though maybe this question is for the “Media” forum):

Ritek G04 disks work better in the Pioneer 107D
Beall disks work better in the NEC ND2500A

Hello.
I have been reading the forums, and I have reached the conclusion that:

Ritek-G04 disks perform better with the Pioneer 107D
while…
BeAll disks perform better with the NEC 2500A

Am I right?

thanks in advance

Nobody can answer this! With the next firmware release everything can be different. The quality of RiTEK G04 is varying, so there could be some discs that work “better” or “worse” than BeAll in both drives.

In the review of the ND-2500A, there are error scans done with KProbe and “slow” reading curves. Fact is, KProbe results don’t have anything to do with objective writing quality (according to German c’t magazine 14/2004) and slow reading curves (nearly) always look good. Readout speed of up to 16x shows weaknesses in the end of my MCC 01RG20, also with the firmware used in the review. It could be my batch of media, but if you want to be sure, write them @6x, then it’s outstanding! Remember that it is certified for 4x only! :wink: