Quality scan results differ from software to software

vbimport

#1

I know that scans will differ from drive to drive slightly.
But I experienced now the first time that big differences testing a disc several times on the same drive.
The results differ from software to software. When I test the disc with the same software again then the results stay within the expected limits - so the difference seems to be how the software is interpreting the information which was retrieved from the drive.

drive: Plextor PX-B950UE with firmware 1.05
software:
a) PlextUtilities 1.33
b) Opti Drive Control 1.70
c) LtnFlash 2.6.11

Jitter:
a) max: 12.5% avg: 11.0%
b) max: 15.4% avg: 13.1%
c) max: 14.4% avg: 12.7%
Speed: PU seems to scan only with 1x, ODC 2x, LtnFlash was scanned 4x speed but I did earlier several tests which showed that 1x, 2x and 4x don’t really differ (at least not when using LtnFlash)

LDC:
a) max 256, avg 5,2
b) max 308, avg 2,5

I dont care for the different values of the spikes - but how do I get 100% difference of the average value?


#2

I tested now 4 different Blu-Rays.
The average LDC shown by PlexUtilities is always about the double than the results shown by Opti Drive Control.

Can anybody confirm this?


#3

The problem doesn’t seem to appear with the PX-[B]L[/B]B950SA (1st generation)

Here are 4 scans of the same disc (2x PX-LB950 and 2x PX-B950).
It is even possible that also the average BIS values are also not correct.

I tried to burn the disc at 4x speed - therefore the high spike at the beginning. The burner/disc-combo didn’t like it.

I would guess that the trick to make ODC work with the newer LiteOn-drives is causing the problem.






#4

Lazy man’s best educated guess:
Re: Post [B]#1[/B]…
IF PlexUtilities’ “Sampling” is the same as ODC’s “Samples”:
PlexUtilites has a much lower sample count than ODC. If ODC takes more samples, it’s possible that those samples are all “low-value samples” included in the average which in turn drives the average down. That might account for the LDC and BIS differences.

Jitter?
Overall jitter trend is the same. The difference in speeds may account for the higher overall percentage while having the same trend, but I can’t dedicate enough brain power to explain how the different software might interpret it to cause such differences. Multiple users have reported that ONE of the above used software packages reports HIGH jitter…

[QUOTE=memory;2656547]mediarange 4x BD-R
PHILIP-R04
iHBS112-2 CL0K
OPC off
Burned at 8x / [B]effective 6x[/B]
final scan with iHBS112-2 1st generation @ plextor PX-LB950SA 1.02 2nd generation using PlexUtilities v1.3.2.

odc 1.70 shows wrong (to high) jitter results, reproducible. for jitter use the (liteon?) special tool “LtnFlash v2.6.11”. :bigsmile:
the plextor (liteon) special tool “PlexUtilities 1.3.2” verified the ldc and bis results of odc 1.70.
transfer rate test (= iHBS112-2 1st generation @ plextor PX-LB950SA 1.03 2nd generation)
always the same burner. :cool:[/QUOTE]

[QUOTE=jadburner;2656568]I’m seeing the same thing - ODC 1.70 consistently reports higher jitter than LtnFlash. BIS and LDC are fairly consistent between ODC 1.50 and 1.70, and PlexUtilities.[/QUOTE]

So, try to work with those findings as possible. (And to further verify/codify these findings, click the arrow associated with one of the quotes and see if the scans agree with the general trend you see.)

EDIT: Yes, if PlexTools scans jitter at 1x, then that explains the difference between it and LtnFlash.


#5

Re: Post [B]#3[/B]…

Just to reiterate: iHBS112 and iHBS212 are known to scan differently.
Your iHBS212 is installed internally, correct? the LB950[B]SA[/B]?

And the iHBS112 is external? B950[B]UE[/B]?

iHBS112/B950UE gets fewer samples over external connection than the iHBS212/LB950SA.

The iHBS112 seems to have many more dropped samples with PlexUtilities. In this case, that allows a lot more of the peaks to make it through without any of the valleys to make the average go down. This is relative to ODC.

The iHBS212, being installed internally, doesn’t seem to have (percentage-wise) that great a difference between its reported samples, though it overall dislikes the disc a bit more (understandable, knowing how 112 and 212 disagree generally).

My general response:
The overall trend is the same between the drives, and is the same regardless of the speed, which is what you must pay attention to. Maybe the values are calculated a little differently, and maybe one interface/software means you get more samples than the other interface/software, but you can still tell when a disc is decent and when it’s questionable, which is your goal.

Now, I’m sure some of the BD-RE experts around here have better answers than me, and I welcome them to come and clean up the mess I just typed out. :bigsmile:


#6

Oh - I see only now the different sample counts. I wasn’t aware yet that an external drive could test differently (less samples) than the internal one. But there is no real rule.
And from the mathematical point - the sample count shouldn’t really matter (in the long term).

I tested & compared now more than 10 discs. Here are the results of the average LDC (PlexUtilities vs ODC):

1,5 vs 0,80
0,9 vs 0,28
1,4 vs 0,69
0,6 vs 0,27
1,2 vs 0,54
3,5 vs 1,63
4,9 vs 2,53
5,2 vs 2,45
55,6 vs 28,09
30,7 vs 15,17
28,6 vs 12,89
20,9 vs 11,67
32,9 vs 15,21
140,1 vs 63,33

Except for disc 2 the result of PlexUtilities is about the double.

Is there still other software available which does LDC/BIS scanning?!


#7

Another disc:

1st scan is with PX-LB950SA, the 2 others were done with a PX-B950UE.

The results for the LB950 with ODC and the B950 with PlexUtilities are more similar.

But ODC delivers with the B950 50% lower average values.
I don’t have enough ODC scans with the LB950 yet - but it looks so whether they are more similar to the results of PlexUtilies @ B950.

I also think that the PX-B950UE is a iHBS312. Is there a way to confirm this?

I still don’t trust the results of ODC which i get with the trick (for newer
generation LiteOn)

(btw I think that i should mention that the scan with the LB-950SA is 6 weeks older)



#8

The program with red/blue graph reminds me of KProbe. Is that now Plexutilities?


#9

This is PlexUtilities and works only with the new Plextor drives (the LiteOn ones).


#10

OK, Thank you