Premium problems: BAD Verbatim MEDIA! UDMA, bad sectors, what do you think?

Hello

This post looks a little long but it’s because I have documented it very well with graphics and logs. I appreciate in advance your collaboration with my questions.

First of all, this is my equipment:

Board: Asus P4C800E-Deluxe
RAM: 1GB Corsair
Latest drivers and BIOS (Intel chipset Installation Utyl, etc).
Primary IDE:
Master: Pioneer DVD-ROM DVD 106s - UDMA4
Slave: Plextor CD-R Premium - UDMA2
Secondary IDE:
Master: BenQ DW1620 DVDRW - UDMA2
Slave: None
Primary Intel SATA:
Maxtor 6B300SO - UDMA5

I don’t use my Premium so much, I mainly use my BenQ DVDRW in DVD+R and +RW burning. Before Christmas eve I was ripping some CDs and I decided to use my Premium for its good reputation in this field. I was using EAC with the default parameters that it assigned for my Premium.

One of the cds that I was ripping appears to be badly damaged (not physically but it looks like it was poorly recorded). EAC could not rip it totally and I got a windows error. I think I had turned off my computer because Windows was not responding. My XP event viewer showed several of the following events:

Event Type:	Warning
Event Source:	Cdrom
Event Category:	None
Event ID:	51
Date:		08.01.2006
Time:		1:15:15
Description:
An error was detected on device \Device\CdRom1 during a paging operation.

------------------------------------------------------

Event Type:	Error
Event Source:	atapi
Event Category:	None
Event ID:	9
Date:		08.01.2006
Time:		1:15:25
Description:
The device, \Device\Ide\IdePort0, did not respond within the timeout period.

------------------------------------------------

Event Type:	Error
Event Source:	Cdrom
Event Category:	None
Event ID:	7
Date:		08.01.2006
Time:		1:04:58
Description:
The device, \Device\CdRom1, has a bad block.

I didn’t continue ripping. After some days I noticed that burning a CDRW on Nero 6 on the Premium was taking almost 50% CPU use and I was getting BurnProof kicking a lot during the burning process. I checked the UDMA status of the IDE controller where the drive is and found that it was working on PIO mode. the other drive (Pioneer DVD-ROM) on the same IDE channel was still on UDMA4. I then followed the sticky threads in the forum to return my controller to UDMA2. I uninstalled it and let XP detect it again. It worked.

I was thinking that my problems were solved but when burning later a Verbatim 32X CD-RW with Nero I got again a fail, could not finish the burning process and again I got EventIDs like the ones posted above in Event Viewer.

I then started to use CD-SPEED to diagnose the problem and my Premium could not burn the Verbatim CD-RW using the Create Data Disc option, I got a fail code (didn’t write it down) and again the evil EventIDs. My IDE channel was put in PIO several times after the fails and I returned it to UDMA again and again.

Today I am running even more tests with the latest CD-SPEED downloaded from cdspeed2000.com and the strange thing is that everything appears to be working again. I have run several test, quality scanning with some old and trusty Prodisc 10X CD-RW and they are burned and read fine, CD-SPEED quality tests (run on my BenQ DVDRW) show that the discs burned by the Premium are ok. I have used another CD-RW from the new Verbatim 32X package and it burns normally and is read ok using CD-SPEED transfer tests.

The quality scores are nothing to be proud about (my max score using the Verbatim CD-RW has been 46 reading always on the BenQ DVDRW at MAXIMUN speed, the Prodisc CD-RW scored 92 at MAXIMUN speed, but it was burned just at 10X compared to the 32X of the Verbatim). I am not so sure how accurate this test is for CD-RWs.

After all this testing I have some conclusions:

  1. I think after the tests done that these Verbatims are BAD MEDIA. I don’t have any other high speed CD-RW media to test, only my old and trusty Prodisc 10X. Are these Verbatims crap? I cannot find them in the user base.

This is the info of the Verbatim media (I don’t remember any other program for getting the ATIP info for CDs at the moment, hope that CD-Speed info is enough):

Nero CD-DVD Speed: Disc Info
Basic Information
 Disc type:    : CD-RW
 Manufacturer: : Verbatim
 MID           : 97m34s25f
 Write speeds: : 32 X
 Capacity:     : 79:59.74
               : 703 MB
Extended Information
 Usage         : General
 Disc Status   : Empty
Raw Data
ATIP
0000 - 80 00 DF 00 61 22 19 00 4F 3B 4A 00 00 00 80 00 - ....a"..O;J.....
0010 - 39 80 00 00 04 C4 B8 00                         - 9.......

This is the info of the trusty Prodisc CD-RWs:

Nero CD-DVD Speed: Disc Info
Basic Information
 Disc type:    : CD-RW
 Manufacturer: : Prodisc
 MID           : 97m32s10f
 Write speeds: : 4 X - 10 X
 Capacity:     : 79:59.74
               : 703 MB
Extended Information
 Usage         : General
 Disc Status   : Closed
Raw Data
ATIP
0000 - B3 00 CE 00 61 20 0A 00 4F 3B 4A 00 24 1A D8 00 - ....a...O;J.$...
0010 - 26 B2 4A 00 00 00 00 00                         - &.J.....

The box of the Verbatims says:

Verbatim DatalifePlus
Advanced SERL+ 32X - 700MB
For Ultra-Speed + CD-RW drives Only.

I am getting horrible results from these Verbatim CD-RWs. My BenQ reports scores 10 or even 0 with them. No C2 errors buts LOTS of C1 ones. The disc is perfectly readable in the ScanDisc test tough and the transfer tests are ok too (except from one) but it’s important to point that on the Premium some discs that are readable and appear to be fine (transfer test OK) report very unstable results after been erased and written again. The 2nd. time the same discs can have NO ADITIONAL SENSE INFORMATION errors when in the transfer tests.

Look at some graphics here:

All of these quality scans are made on the BenQ DVDRW as the Plextor is not supported by CD-SPEED quality test. All the disks were burned using CD-SPEED Make Data Disc function.


GOOD SCANS (as an example that the drives appear to be working ok with other CD-RW disks):

One of my old and trusty Prodisc 10X CD-RW burned at 10X on the Premium. It is pretty good for a CD-RW:

Here the same disk burned in the BenQ DVDRW. Not bad either:


THE EVIL VERBATIMS CD-RWs:

Here is a horrible scan of the Verbatim CD-RW recorded on the Plextor Premium:

Here the same disc recorded this time with the BenQ DVDRW drive:

Trying to make a Transfer Rate Test reading on the Premium:

Estrange… same horrible disk reading this time on the BenQ DVDRW:

But what about this, this scan is from the same disk used before but it was when just unpacked and burned for the first time with the Plextor Premium. Read on Plextor Premium too:

As you can see these Verbatims are not reliable, they are very unstable.

  1. Do this tests mean that the BenQ drive is a better reader than the Plextor Premium? Disks that are unreadable on the Premium (NO ADITIONAL SENSE INFO on transfer test) are read ok on the BenQ.

  2. WHAT CD-RW MEDIA do you recommend me for using with the Premium? I was thinking (wrong oviously) that CD-R and -RW this days were a safe buy whatever they are if the mark was known. I was thinking that quality problems and unsupported disks were a matter of DVD and not CD anymore.

Thanks a lot for the help that you can give me. I rate very highly your opinions about this.

This:

is probalby what caused Windows to drop back to PIO Mode. Are you using a unusually long IDE cable or round ones? If this continues to happen you might want to replace the cable with a high quality 80 lead cable.

Ahhh, the fun you can have when trying to burn US+RW :slight_smile:

I don’t know but i’ve never seen other 32x capable RW than the ones from Verbatim. Anyway they are on the recommended media list and therefore supported by the Premiun. So if it doesn’t work with these i hardly see a chance with other media.

As you have found out HS-RW (10x) is no problem at all. If you try US-RW (24x) you’ll find it will usually work, even if the results are no really stellar. US±RW (32x) however seems more or less like playing russian roulette.

It has been observed that writing over a RW several times in sequence will lead to worse results each time. The quality of results can be greatly increased if a full erase is done before each burn. Look here: http://club.cdfreaks.com/showpost.php?p=1238380&postcount=5

One of your scans reports Jitter as high as 24%. That is pretty high. It could be that DVD-Drives generally have higher Jitter tolerance when it comes to CDs (after all DVD-Drives need to be able to read the much finer DVD-structure). However I can’t offer any hard evidence on that matter, that’s just my wild guess.

Stick with those Verbatim (eventually buy 24x only RWs) but limit the speed to 24x or even use 10x RWs only if quality is important.

Are you using the Intel Application Accelerator (IAA)? If so, deinstall and use default Microsoft drivers for your controllers.

regards,
weaker

But if these 32X CD-RW are in the compatibility list then my drive is pretty bad f*cked. I was very sorprised that the Premium could not burn this discs, but it is the reality. Not the Plextor nor the BenQ can burn this things ok. I have tested 2, I have 8 left. What is the chance that all the box is bad? I mean, the results with BOTH my drives are horrible on these puppies. I am taking some to the work and will test there.

It is impossible that this are the recommended CD-RW discs. Is there not another mark out there with high speed CD-RW that can be burned ok?

@weaker: I am not using IAA, I am not even using RAID at all. Only think installed is the Intel INF chipset installation utility.

Thanks both for your posts.

No. Writing RW @32x means bringing RW technology to its absolute limits (maybe evern overstepping thos limits quite a bit). This is very similar to burning CD-R @52x speed. Not every disk will work. Not even 52x certified ones. That doesn’t make your drive defective.

But they are: http://www.plextor.be/technicalservices/technology/recmedia.asp?choice=Supported%20media :iagree: (Mitsubishi Chemical = Verbatim)

I took a new of these things to the work and burned it @32X on a NEC DVDRW drie there. The results on CD-SPEED were horrible. Quality was 0 there too.

Then I was gonna try to burn these things @10X or something under 32X but my Premium only has 32X in the burn speed field on Nero 6. My BenQ DVDRW reports 24X and 16X then I decided to give the last one a try. Here are the results, nothing better than the first tries @32X with the Plextor drive:

I will use these as coasters and I am still searching for good CD-RW media. Unfortunatly here in Norway it appears that CD-RW is almost inexistent. I can only find these horrible Verbatims.

Thanks.