Playo DVD+R DL -> RICOHJPN-D00-01 problems

vbimport

#1

i picked these up from newegg for less than $1/ea and was surprised they show up in imgburn as RICOHJPN-D00-01 media. i was pretty happy until i started to burn. i get an error that states there is a problem with imgburn trying to do the power calibration. Nero also erros out (don’t have that one exactly but it was very close). DVD Decrypter also gives me the error about the calibration area as does xbc (xbox backup creator - for 360 backups of my originals).

i have used verbatims that show up as MKM-001-00 and actually thought the Ricoh JPN discs were better but i am not too familiar with dvd dl media as i normally use single layer dvds.

even with the verbatims, i have about a 60% success rate with it just stopping randomly at any given point during the burn.

my computer specs are a x2 3800 (tried from stock up to 2.5GHz), 2GB pc3200, 2x15K u320 scsi hdds, 1x120GB pata hdd, xp pro w/ sp2 and all the updates. the version of Nero is 7.5.7.0, DVD Decrypter is the latest (last version) and imgburn is the newest version, xbc has the same problems with ver 2.3.x and 2.4.x. the drive is a pioneer 111d w/ the newest firmware - 1.29. the machine is prime95 stable, memtest stable, gaming stable and this is honesty the first issue i have had with burning anything with it or burning anything in the 10+ yrs i have been burning.

i am a bit shocked with the amount of failures i have had - i have never had this type of failures, even about 10yrs ago when i was running a parallel port 2x hp cd-rw…

i was under the impression that the pioneer 111d was a decent drive, but also have, but have not tried my other 2 dl drives - 1 being a benq1655 and also a nec 2500A (which i would like to convert a 2510A if somebody could send me in the correct direction for a firmware upgrade…)

the 360 images are from my own originals, so this is not the case of a bad image.

i have tried the playo discs from anywhere in the spindle and they all do the same thing.

i have looked up on the pioneer website and it states my drive (111d) is compatible with the Ricoh DVD+R DL i have.

i have even disabled everything and left the machine alone with the image being on my fastest 15k scsi hdd - a seagate 15k.5 that has over a 100MB/s transfer rate, so i know that is not the problem and i am only trying to burn at 2.4x, so as you can imagine i am rather perplexed at the extremely high failure rate.

any advice you could give me regarding this situation would be greatly appreciated as even the verbatim failure rate is unacceptable to me with the hardware i have. also, all of my m/b drivers are up-to-date and as of this point in time the only drive i have tested is the pioneer due to its good reputation.

thanks in advance for you time and knowledge,
bob


#2

Stick to buying Verbatims, they’re by far the safest choice for DL discs. At least you have 3 great burners, you should have a high success rate with Verbatim on any of those drives IMO. I also bought some of these Playo discs to try out when they were very cheap (about $.40 per disc). I knew before I bought them that they were poor quality but for the price I thought I’d try a few - they are fake RICOHJPN discs BTW. Well 20 discs later on about 5 different burners, I have about 14 discs that didn’t even complete the burns, and only 1 or 2 out of the 20 that are marginally playable on my standalone players. Playo SL media is decent, cheap media but for DL discs they’re not worth the hassle at any price really.

I also have a Pioneer 111L and a NEC 2510, those 2 drives are probably the best two for these discs that I have. If you want to try your NEC, just go to Liggy and Dee’s website and use their modified 2.FA firmware. http://liggydee.cdfreaks.com/page/en/NEC-ND-2500A/ I found both of these drives were pretty similar in burn quality, but the NEC was less apt to have a failed burn.


#3

any clue on the high failure rate with the verbatims on the pioneer 111d?


#4

No, but if you have a problem then try one of the other two burners. While the NEC is an old burner, it’s actually very good and as I said it was the least apt of all of my drives to fail during a burn. The 1655 is also a great burner, particularly with SL media though it should burn your Verbatim discs fine as well. Your failures may be related to the drive, a lesser batch of discs, etc.


#5

i will give the other 2 a try. just out of curiosity, which do you think would do better, the 2500A flashed or the 1655? the reason i ask is because i currently have 3 machines running. the 2500 is in my home server which is a xp2000/1GBpc3200/~700GB of hdd space - it runs as a print server, runs a couple databases for about 5-8 websites along with apache, mysql, php and a ftp server and also houses images of all the other machines hdds, including its own via acronis. the 1655 is in a 550MHz P3/256MB of ram machine that runs win2k pro and a https setup version of apache, now i know the 550MHz machine is pretty much too weak to do any burning and it only has a ~10GB 5400rpm hdd so that is kind of out of the question.

do you think i should move the 1655 to the xp2000 machine or go ahead and flash the 2500A and use it? i am just trying to save a bit of moving around of hardware here…i guess being a bit lazy.

also, with the playo discs, would you recommend i even try them for a backup of my 360 games on the other drives (i have the originals so it realy doesn’t matter if they don’t last long, i can just make another backup) or should i try to get my $$ back from newegg since they don’t work in at least 1 burner?

thanks in advance,
bob


#6

Actually you should be able to burn at 2.4x just fine in your PIII system - I have a PIII 450mhz and I can burn at 8x fine with a 7200 HD. But even your current HD shouldn’t be any issue for 2.4x-4x burns I wouldn’t think (maybe 8x but don’t know on that), though you may not have enough space for a full DL disc backup on it. As for the 1655 vs. the 2500 with Verbatim discs, I can’t say for sure on that one, but with the Playo discs my NEC was the least likely to coaster out. I have a 1655 and I got one good burn with a Playo disc, but the 2nd try was a coaster - not that that necessarily means anything though with these discs as they are so troublesome to begin with, and I have had several coasters with the NEC as well. Whether you return them or try them on the other burners, that’s up to you, maybe you’ll find a combination that works decently enough that you can use the rest.

Not sure if you are familiar with quality scanning using your Benq and Nero CD-DVD Speed, but if you get successful burns from your NEC, Benq, and Pioneer then you can perform quality scans on those discs and decide for yourself which drive appears to give the best results. The NEC may have given me slightly higher error and jitter levels, but it was the most successful at completing the burns.


#7

thanks for the info again :slight_smile: the slow machine only has 7GB free, so no on that one. i am going to be moving my server hdds around and just have 1 w/ 3 partitions, then the 550MHz machine can get a 30GB 7200 hdd - yay :slight_smile:

as far as the playo discs, i think i am out one of the cake boxes because it is open, but 3 of them are not, so i am going to try to get a credit for some verbatims on those. i will be d/l that firmware for the 2500A and will give that a try.

i think i will try that nero cd-dvd speed program a try on the ones that i have had good luck with.

still trying to figure out why such a low succes rate with the verbatims and the 111d…could i have received a bad batch? i am sure that is possible becaue i have tried the optical/hdd setup in every possibly combination, coming from scsi or ide and still have the same random failure rate - that is the weird part - totally random. i even put a multimeter on my rig and stressed it and the V were all very close and in spec so it is not a power issue. weird…

thanks again for all the info.

one dumb question - with the cd-dvd speed, do i use the drive i burned the discs on or always on a certain drive?

[B]edit - on the firmware for the 2500->2510 do i want the original, fast or rpc1?[/B]


#8

Who else than you should know that?

If your Pioneer burner is giveing “bad results” then its either the hardware, the media (Playo DL, oh god), or it is not correclty set up.


#9

Aren’t Playo DL’s fake :confused:


#10

Maybe you can get credit for the opened spindle and put the bad burns in it, I don’t know. Regarding CD-DVD Speed, your Benq is the only drive that’s a good drive for quality scanning (the Pioneer can perform it but not very well). It doesn’t matter which burner was used, use the Benq only for doing the quality scans, and 8x is the ‘forum standard’ and a good speed to start with for testing. For the firmware with the NEC, I’d say ‘fast’, it allows faster read speeds.


#11

Yes (I mentioned that in my initial post but it’d be easily missed).


#12

sounds good. how long should a quality scan take? it seems that whenever i have done one the program locks up at 50-51%…and has never finished on the pioneer drive.

is there a certain firmware that the benq needs to make it “standard” with the forum so i can compare it to others output?


#13

No specific firmware needed, and use the Benq as I mentioned. If it locked up at 50% on the Pioneer, it may have been because of a bad burn at the layer change. An 8x scan in the Benq should take around 15-20 minutes with a DL disc.


#14

IIRC Pioneer 111 series drives always lock up at the layer break during a CDSpeed scan, so that has nothing to do with the quality of the disc.


#15

one last question - will the 550MHz machine be ok to handle this or do i need to put that drive in a faster machine?


#16

It can handle slower speeds like I mentioned above. Assuming that there aren’t any other significant bottlenecks, 4x should be no issue at all and 8x will probably be ok as well.


#17

did a quality read on the playo disc that was a 360 game that was burned on the 2510 w/ 2.05d firmware and imgburn2- quality = 0. it was doing good - quality of 95 until the layer - then it went all to hell, 0 just like that.

did a scan of a verbatim dl burned on the pioneer 111d, and same thing - all good until the layer and the wham - quality = 0…

i will post some screen probably tomorrow as it is getting late

i guess i need to do a scan of the orginal game, and see how that comes out…


#18

Out of the 100 or so that I have burned on my Verbatim in the last several months on my Pioneer 111D (with TDB V1.29 firmware), I have only had 1 coaster that wasn’t my fault. I realize that this really isn’t a comprehensive review covering multiple users and burners but my experience definitely IS NOT UNIQUE with the D/L Verbatim. They are by far the best D/L media out there and the most Versatile regardless of drive, firmware revision or application.


#19

i looked through some of your other post and notice you do the 360 backups of your originals too but are getting 90+…do you think the DB firmware has anything to do with it? mine are horrible compared to yours, although they do work in the 360, but the couple i have tested with the nero program show quality of 0…i am doing this because i broke a original game disc, and that was a $65 error, but i don’t want to f*ck my the 360 dvd-rom by using the backups i am making…how are your burns with xbc?


#20

I use IMG Burn for all of my 360 backups. BTW what speed are you burning at?
As for TDB firmware making a difference, I have no idea since all of my 360 burns were done after I upgraded to it, so I can’t really do a comparison.