Pif

[jegus]

Hi

I hope you can explain this to me

In Nero CD-DVD Speed - Scan Disc Quality:

When I scan a disc in my Lite-On SOHW-1673 the green shaded area for PIF is limited to 4.

But if I scan in my BenQ 1620 the green shaded area for PIF goes up to 16.

Why is there a differance?

In what drive should I test my discs?

Kind Regards
jegus

[rugger]

The DVD specifications say that a dvd should not produce (the errors are not so much on the disk as they are created by the readback process) theses error rates when read:

1) No set of 8 consecutive ecc blocks should have a combined total PI error rate of more then 280.
2) Each ecc block should not have more then 4 PO errors. Note that most drives only report PIF, which can be ussually be used as a good appoximation of PO.

Now, the difference is that the Liteon drive reports statistics for each ECC block read, and the software tallies it up, displaying combined 8xECC block readings for PI, and single block statistics for PIF errors. This means that each PIF reading needs to be 4 PIF or less for a passing DVD.

For the Benq drive though, the drive only returns statistics for each set of 8 ECC blocks. Therefore the PIF reading can be up to 32 and the DVD could still pass the DVD specifications. The author decided to make 16 the cutoff though, because as PIF increases beyond 16, the likelyhood of a single block being higher then 4 becomes greater.

[jegus]

Thank you for replying so fast rugger!

I think I understand...

So you can say this:

As long as PIF stays in the green shaded area, my DVD-disc will function without any problems?

[rugger]

Probably function without problems, at least on msot reasonable drives.

No garrentee though. Often best to scan a disk with both drives, at least until you understand the behaviour of your disks.

[chas0039]

Different drives have different error correction abilities, so nothing is certain when it comes to reading on your player. If the PIF stays in the green and the total count is low, you are doing as much as you can do, short of playing everything on your player all the way through.

[jegus]

If the PIF stays in the green and the total count is low.

How much PIF total is considered as low Chas?

[chas0039]

Look at my sig. link to media scores to see a range of differences with different media. I am very critical so I look for scores with a total under 250. Good drives are able to get there on MCC and TY media with no problem. I suppose that totals under 2000 are playable but I have to assume more errors can increase readability problems over time.

[rugger]

sigh, I'd throw most of my disks away if I had to accept such rigourous results.

The only times I can get < 250 PIF total is with TYG02, and not even then half the time. Not even my Fuju YUDONT001 DVD+R disks don't get that.

[chas0039]

TYG02 and TYG01 can be had for near $30 now as the Value media. Most of my best scans come from these. I know it is boring, but very soon all I will use is TY.

[dtog]

TYG02 and TYG01 can be had for near $30 now as the Value media. Most of my best scans come from these. I know it is boring, but very soon all I will use is TY.

It's amazing that there is just ONE media maker that REALLY goes out of its way in the quality dept. I really wished TY had thier own brand in the U.S. like they do in Asia. (That's) No risk taking when buying media. At least FUJI is a good source of DVD+R and sometimes can score some TY DVD-R from Fuji. But those M.I.J. DVD-R seem to be rare.

[chas0039]

Rima, Supermedia and Meritline are always genuine TY.

[jegus]

Chas:

I scanned a disc burned on Lite-On with KProbe, and it only had 13 PIF Total. It was TYG01, and I was very pleased.

Then I scanned the same disc in my BenQ with Nero CD-DVD Speed 3.80, and it had over 1400 PIF Total.

[Quikee]

Chas:

I scanned a disc burned on Lite-On with KProbe, and it only had 13 PIF Total. It was TYG01, and I was very pleased.

Then I scanned the same disc in my BenQ with Nero CD-DVD Speed 3.80, and it had over 1400 PIF Total.

This is something you can expect from LiteOn.. they under report values (and drop samples) because they are "good readers" so they won't show you the trouble where there is one. I saw this many times in reviews where LiteOn shows good results but the BenQ doesn't and the transfer rate test on a third drive shows speed drops as well.

[jegus]

Quikee: OK, I guess I won't be scanning my discs in my Lite-On drive anymore.