Old FTI/Falcons Deteriorating


#1

I haven’t been around for awhile.

I wanted to both mention & ask if others are experiencing this: late last decade, many including myself were quite pleased with FTI media. Lately, I’ve been noticing that unlike TY, my older Falcons have almost all shown significant deterioration. Have others been experiencing this?


#2

This would be TTH02/TDK003 based Falcon media? The TDK’s DVD dye/spec has fairly well-documented degradation problems. It’s one of the reasons that I completely avoid all FTI media. MCC & other MID’s based media manufactured by FTI are OK usually though, or are you having problems with those?


#3

I am also interested to know the same as I am thinking to buy some Falcon (TTH02) printable waterproof media to try.


#4

TTH02. Back in the late 00’s, FTI had a good rep on this board.


#5

In my experience, I would stay away from FTI. Early this decade their QC became dreadful imo. I don’t know what to suggest anymore, as the one cake of CMC TY’s I tried wasn’t real good either. I stocked up on JVC TY’s before they sold out.


#6

You just reminded me, I need to check some of my older Made in UAE Verbs. I also bought alot of those last decade. I so far haven’t run across degradation issues with those, but I have so many discs I probably haven’t gotten to many of them lately.


#7

From everything I know, Falcon is the only DVD and CD game left in town, with respect to quality. I’ve used them exclusively since 2011 or so when I first found out about them. For important projects I use their Dual Layer DVD media or, if price is not an issue, their Archival DVD/CD media lines. So far I’ve had zero issues but that is the same with all my TDK DVD media as well (not sure about the codes for all of them but I have at least some of the above mentioned codes).

I’m upgrading my old Data DVD’s and CD’s to Blu-ray (Panasonic) over time and everything so far has read back just fine with no unrecoverable errors. I should take a closer look at my older TDK media now and some of the first Falcon’s I burned.

Thanks for the heads up MooMoo but there is no where else to go that I am aware of. TY is dead and they were the only other brand one could trust for quality DVD/CDs.


#8

I know this is retrospective quaterbacking… BUT IMO, you should have gone with VERBATIMs even the crappier ones were better than generic media. I’ll admit that I didn’t always buy Verbatim, but on the other hand, for the most part… it’s primarily my CDRs that are going the way of the DODO on data integrity, but I moved most of my media from CDR to DVDrs long ago. AND I am NOT looking forward to the move of the DVD media to BLU RAY!! So much software becomes obsolete which I will not move over-- good riddance. This is in part what stopped me dead in my tracks from archiving so much stuff. Also, the internets have enough stuff floating to keep one occupied for a millennia.
What I am concerned about is keeping analog tape conversions alive on discs long term. Stuff that would be difficult to re-convert as aging analog tape becomes more difficult to obtain a good copy of again.
A good rule of thumb is use GOOD media and re-backup every 5-9 years and check the data every (other) year. Have 3 to 4 copies (one on flash, one on hdd) with at least ONE stored in a different location.

What other than home/personal videos to people need to re-archive and preserve for so long on disc? Just wondering. I’m sure I still have software and games going all the way back to the windows 95 days-- not sure it will be usable as easily when Microsoft evolves to EOL 16/32 bit software.


#9

I may be misunderstanding your post; but back in the day I didn’t consider Falcon generic any more than TY. TY’s had the same style of branding, on the outer packaging only. Other than FTI Verb’s I’ve actually had much worse luck with OEM manufactured brand names! What got me into caring about this stuff was my first 100 Ricoh Japan Maxells literally had the back half of the dye fade from every disc under moderate climate storage in 3 months or so!


#10

CH, I agree I don’t know of any quality blank media still in existence. All of the Verbs in the North West USA are made in India, Taiwan, Singapore, etc.

Speaking of TDK; I did have a great experience with a bunch of TDK white labled cdr’s with the TDK mid & a darker blue than usual dye I got a few years ago from Myce member James Cooley. I have always had bad luck with TDK branded discs, though.

I really do need to find the time to check my FTI’s before it’s too late. I’ve had to reburn almost everyone I’ve tested. All but one DVD9 were still rippable.


#11

I’ve been using Falcon CDs DVDs and Blu-rays for a few years and so far so good although I don’t burn anything I can still replace second hand. (sometimes cheaper than a disc) TTH02 MID, I hope they are good as they are so incredibly expensive.


#12

[quote=“MooMooMooMoo, post:10, topic:398343, full:true”]
CH, I agree I don’t know of any quality blank media still in existence. All of the Verbs in the North West USA are made in India, Taiwan, Singapore, etc.[/quote]
I guess I will continue with Falcon media then. There just isn’t anyone else out there.

That is amazing MooMoo. I’ve had the complete opposite experience with both FTI and TDK (generic included). I wonder if it has to do with climate or something related. I live in the North West except I live in Canada so maybe a little less humidity then where you are, might be the reason.

All of the cheap generic TDK store bought discs all work fine, the made by TDK discs work fine and my FTI discs are still good too from what I have looked at. I’ve had zero complaints from customers. Maybe it is all that love for them that keeps them alive. :wink:


#13

Considering your geography have any of you considered Delkin Devices disks? Supposed to be manufactured in USA.


#14

SL or DL DVD±R? These are pretty much the highest quality recordable DVD media you can find, and I would stock up on them if you can still get SL Singapore made discs.

TDK’s cyanine CD-R’s were great, would consider them one of the best CD-R’s ever made, many as good or possibly better than Taiyo Yuden’s best production. I still have a lot of them I stocked up before they disappeared ~15 years ago.

FTI CD-R’s made with TDK ATIP (97m15s05f) are very good, but it’s kind of uninteresting to pay premium prices for P-Cyanine discs, especially when Taiwanese P-Cyanine CD-R’s can still be pretty good.

The degradation problems with TDK media, which as I stated are well-known and documented, are limited to the [URL=“TTH02 warning - degradation”]16x DVD media[/URL], I think. This is the same spec that FTI sells under their Falcon brand.

To everyone commenting: Continue their usage at your discretion. But if there’s so many people experiencing problems, for over a decade and with separate manufacturers, why risk it and waste your time when you can buy discs proven not to degrade for much cheaper? It is not all about pretty quality scans, not even close.


#15

Delkin Devices Archival Gold DVD-R? Gold reflective layer in DVD-R + made by MAM-A = no good! Actually this could be one of the worst stuff you can find, if you don’t count degrading MID’s like RITEK G05 (at least its more compatible and the initial burn quality is decent).

Gold reflective layer in DVD-R’s is something I do not like to recommend, but if you’re really into that then at least use Verbatim’s Ultralife Gold DVD-R which uses a Silver reflective layer underneath the Gold, improving reflectivity and thus should be no worse than a regular DVD-R. Used to be made by Prodisc, I believe it’s FTI now. MCC MID’s.

Unfortunately Made in USA has never really guaranteed the best quality when it comes to recordable optical media (unlike in many other industries). There used to be good manufacturers of CD-R’s in America in the 1990s (TDK, Kodak, Ricoh, etc.) but generally even those were more or less inferior to their Japanese-made counterparts, with the exception of Kodak. These days “Made in USA” means MAM-A in most cases and their quality isn’t up to par to what it was under the Mitsui’s ownership.


#16

That is why I love this forum. So much knowledge about optical media. :sunglasses:

I guess FTI’s 8x media is better for the long haul then (like their Archival Platinum and Gold discs). It seems the 16x ones are technically out for long term storage from all the info presented thus far.

I know duplication places use FTI 16x in place of TY 16x DVDs. I wonder if there is any steady stream of good 16x DVD-R then for duplication and printing? Sounds like I should use FTI’s Platinum 8x discs for paying customers instead of the standard 16x, even though the 16x ones have a great waterproof printing surface available. I would sooner make a disc that keeps on playing for years to come then to have the best looking and protected print top.


#17

Until CMC bought TY, the TY entry level silver shiny pro 8x +'s were my go to dvd for quality. I got much better scans with them than any other TY, including the more expensive printable 8x +'s.

I haven’t tried anything new since the CMC purchase & at that time I bought 1 cake of the CMC TY 8x+'s & also tried Media Supply’s 16x - house brand for customers.

There is absolutely nothing available right now that I am aware of that I would buy for personal use.

Even the quality of affordable flash drives has gone down the toilet in the last year. My go to was the now discontinued Corsair Flash Voyager Slider. Now their entry level drive is the much lower quality Slider X-1. And most other companies have turned to total garbage (Lexar is a prime example, as is Sandisk).


#18

Update: I have checked some of my media burned in 2010 up until now and my FTI 16x DVDs are fine. No deterioration to report. They are all about 95-97% perfect according to Nero. The same as when they were burned. Same with my 16x TDK’s with the same MID’s that I purchased at Costco 95-97% to this day.

Now my CMC made cheap TDK branded discs are junk but I expected that. The dual-layer 8x TDK branded are the worst but I knew that already. The 2.4x I haven’t checked yet but those I think are of a different quality since they were rather expensive at the time and Dual-layer had just come out.

I do take care of my discs to the best of my knowledge and resources but I am going to keep checking all my media back to 2004 (TDK 2x-8x DVDs). But so far, 0 issues to report on this 16x TDK MID deterioration issue on my end.

Happy burning! :sunglasses: