Ogg vorbis

Is ogg vorbis is superior to mp3 format?
:slight_smile:
read about it here

Well, 90% of the document are about very basics of digital audio, and the other 10% don’t contain much about ogg audio either. The only facts he mentions is that Ogg doesn’t cost anything, and that it can achieve higher quality than MP3 with less data.
These are 2 important points, of course.

But the author is obviously slightly confused:

The decibel range for human hearing is complicated and depends on the frequency of the sound in question, but roughly ranges from 0 to 120 dB, with each change in 10 dB corresponding to a doubling of the volume.
A volume of 120 dB is likely to cause irreversible damage to a human’s ears. I don’t understand the 10db-double-Volume thing either. 3dB more means a double amplitude, so 10 dB more means roughly 10 times the amplitude.
The author claims that 10 times the amplitude means double volume, but the human ear works on a logarithmic scale. It’s imho really hard to say what exactly is “double volume”.

Not really from his article, but I need to say this:
24 bit for DVD-Audio
Yes, people are indeed fooled by this and believe in this. It’s actually techincally impossible to gain a precision of more than 20 bits for an analog signal (and up to now, every digital signal is converted to analog before it’s played) at costs which normal people can afford. That means that the 4 LSB of data either contain only crap information, or are virtually ignored for replay.

thank you alexnoe:bigsmile: .i edited thread in the form of a question.so is ogg.vorbis format really superior to mp3 format if so what is the best tools to use for encodeding,decoding and burning to cd.:bigsmile:

I’d say the greatest advantage is that it is open source, and that encoders / players are freeware.

better depends on the bitrate…and on the person that listens to it

mp3 is better known

www.vorbis.com

Originally posted by alexnoe

[B]But the author is obviously slightly confused:

Quote “The decibel range for human hearing is complicated and depends on the frequency of the sound in question, but roughly ranges from 0 to 120 dB, with each change in 10 dB corresponding to a doubling of the volume.” Unquote

A volume of 120 dB is likely to cause irreversible damage to a human’s ears. I don’t understand the 10db-double-Volume thing either. 3dB more means a double amplitude, so 10 dB more means roughly 10 times the amplitude.
The author claims that 10 times the amplitude means double volume, but the human ear works on a logarithmic scale. It’s imho really hard to say what exactly is “double volume”. [/B]

The author of the subject link is not confused, but perhaps you are. :wink: First, a dynamic range (amplitude, not volume) level of 120 to 130 db is at the threshhold of pain (depending on the subject). The fact that sustained exposure at this level damages hearing is irrelevant to the statement that this is at the upper limit of sound tolerance for humans.

Your misinformed opinion notwithstanding, :cool: there is a solid body of research and evidence related to average human hearing to support his assertion regarding 10 db corresponding to a doubling of the volume. Note that he said, “a doubling of the volume”, not amplitude. Volume is a synonym for the loudness level perceived by the human ear.

If you had clicked on the link in the article, it would lead to comprehensive scientific evidence related to the complex phenomena of human hearing, including “Rule of Thumb” for Loudness

Originally posted by alexnoe The author claims that 10 times the amplitude means double volume, but the human ear works on a logarithmic scale.

Human hearing is approximately logarithmic. It is precisely because of this logarithmic response that 10 times the amplitude is perceived as double volume. See the data and explanation at Sound Level Measurement.

So I’m still right with It’s imho really hard to say what exactly is “double volume”.

Originally posted by alexnoe
So I’m still right with It’s imho really hard to say what exactly is “double volume”.

It is safe to say that in your own mind you will always be right regardless of evidence to the contrary. :cool:

Well can anyone answer my question in a direct manner?:confused:

Technically, Ogg Vorbis is superior to MP3 in that it can encode audio quality equivalent to MP3 at a lower bitrate. As such, the file size will be smaller for Ogg Vorbis compared to an equivalent quality MP3 file.

From a practical point of view, the limited playback support for Ogg Vorbis must be considered. If you are going to use it for audio encoding to be played back on your computer only, then it is not a problem. There are no standalone players of any kind that currently support Ogg Vorbis. The big advantage of MP3 over other audio compression codecs is its portability. Once a standard such as MP3 is entrenched in the mass market, it is difficult for another standard to replace it even if it has some superior qualities.

Ogg Vorbis, WMA, and MP3 Pro all have at least some features that may be superior to MP3. Of these, Ogg Vorbis has the best overall features and opportunites for development. Technically, it is superior to MP3, but whether it will ever replace it is another matter. Memory and media costs are low, and smaller file sizes may not impact the mass market.

Originally posted by Inertia
There are no standalone players of any kind that currently support Ogg Vorbis.

There are plans though, I even believe they should be coming out soon. Better do a search to see if I can find it again. :slight_smile:

You are correct, dansmug, the Ogg Vorbis players are already out.:slight_smile:

Here is the tkcPlayer which plays both MP3 and Ogg Vorbis files. Also see First Ogg Vorbis player for handhelds released.

There is also the MPST Digital Jukebox which is a standalone ripper, encoder, and player for both MP3 and Ogg Vorbis. This device is basically just a dedicated computer and uses Linux as its operating system. It connects to the internet and has an optional mouse and monitor. :bigsmile:

There are other players on the way, and most support seems to be coming from small audio device manufacturers trying to carve out a niche in the market crowded with MP3’s. This is a really healthy development and I hope that Ogg Vorbis is strongly supported not only by audio enthusiasts but general consumers as well. If there continues to be enough of a word of mouth groundswell generating increasing support for Ogg Vorbis, it may yet become a viable general consumer format. :slight_smile: