Now It's Falcon CDR's Going Downhill

vbimport

#1

Got a new batch of Falcon cdr’s today. Compare the 2 scans, both made on the same Plextor at 4x.

The horrible scan is from the new batch, sourced from Discmakers last week

The quality scan is from a similar batch sourced from CD Dimensions a few months ago

It appears that Falcon’s QC has gone downhill big time. I am getting so tried of wasting $'s on poor quality media.


#2

MTK Chipset drives are totally unreliable scanners for CD-r also the second scan is very good quality ;).


#3

Burning speed is too slow, 16x is good unless you have a old Yamaha or Plextor Premium I or II, also you should scan faster, 16x is good here also. :flower:


#4

James, I disagree with you on burning speed. The faster the burn, the more jitter. & in my experience faster burns also cause worse scans.

Yes, I have read the faq on that, & opinions seem to be split 50/50, mine is that slower burns are higher quality.

I also see a huge difference between the 2 scans I posted…


#5

[QUOTE=MooMooMooMoo;2532246]James, I disagree with you on burning speed. The faster the burn, the more jitter. & in my experience faster burns also cause worse scans.

Yes, I have read the faq on that, & opinions seem to be split 50/50, mine is that slower burns are higher quality.

I also see a huge difference between the 2 scans I posted…[/QUOTE]
the scans are totally unreliable it’s impossible to have that low of a C1 count in the first and your burning speed is to slow unless you have a burner that is calibrated for slow burning and so is your scanning speed


#6

7220a/iHAP322=DVD-R scanner @8X
7200=CD-R scanner @20X-max
BenQ DW1640=DVD-R/ CD-R scanning bliss
Try scanning those discs with a drive capable of CD scanning :bigsmile:.
That first scan shows just how bad the MTK is at scanning CD-R’s. The best batch of T-Y CD-R’s I’ve ever scanned with a BenQ never came close to that low total. Do try comparing 7200 scans. I’ve found some batches of Falcon CD’s to burn a bit better at faster speeds(32X vs 16X).


#7

As other have said, DVD burners like the Optiarc AD-7220A that use MediaTek chipsets are not suitable for scanning CD media. The chipset only reports C1 failures (E31) and C2 failures (E32), where proper CD scanners report at least all C1 errors (E11+E21+E31) as well as C2 failures (E32).

So I wouldn’t depend on scans from that drive to determine which burns are good or which which burns are better than other burns. IMO you can only really use such scans to see which burns are really horrible - i.e. showing C2 failures.

The assertion that Falcon CD-R media is going downhill is therefore not only based on a single batch of discs, but it’s also based on flawed measurements.

So I wouldn’t conclude anything from the evidence at hand.


#8

I hear what you’re saying but,

  1. Several people on this forum seem to disagree & state that the 7220a is a quality scanner

  2. Even if it is imperfect, it’s showing a CONSISTANT trend. All discs were burned with the same Plextor Premium. All of the Falcons from a few months ago are scanning similar to the quality scan. All of the new batch of Falcons are showing similar to the 2 bad scans

  3. My last batch of TY premiums ALL showed similar to the old Falcon scan, except ALL of the new TY’s had a big spike at exactly the 50 minute mark. That spike turns up no matter what drive I burn on. I.E. the 7220a is giving consistent, repeatable results. Sorry if that messes with anyone’s set in stone world view.


#9

The 7220a is not a quality scanner for [B]CD’s[/B]. That is what they are telling you. The results cannot be trusted. Drage explained this very well.

And your sample size is hopelessly small.

Do any of the disks fail to play back? My guess is no.


#10

Yes, some discs that are scanning badly are not paying back &/or ripping. The reason I’ve been buying so many cdr’s lately is because before I knew better i used crap grocery store brands a few years back (TDK, Maxell, Sony, Office Depot, etc) & have recently discovered that some of those discs have gone bad just sitting on the shelf. The ones that scan especially poorly will not rip or play.


#11

Guess i’m going to move to just lurking here. Thought i could help others avoid the wasting of $'s I’ve gone through several times as discs that once scanned wonderful now scan like ppop in their current manufacturing standards.


#12

BTW, were these CD-Rs FalconMedia Pro or just FalconMedia? There is a difference.


#13

[QUOTE=negritude;2532627]BTW, were these CD-Rs FalconMedia Pro or just FalconMedia? There is a difference.[/QUOTE]
Everything at their site is listed as PRO. Member claims to have access to a plextor premium why would he not use it as a scanner :stuck_out_tongue:


#14
  1. I currently have 2 Plextors installed, a Premium & a 40/12/40a. Neither will scan with CD Speed. That’s always been the case in this machine; I just assumed Plextor’s were incapable of scanning with Nero. Is there Plex software they will scan with? The Plex’s are in a Win 98 box because they are ide & both of my XP boxes are sata only (I know I could get an adapter, but have never felt the need as 98 seems to burn fine cdr’s.)

  2. The current batch of Falcons are labeled “Falcon Media Pro”. I can’t tell you what the older batches I got from CD Dimensions were labeled, as I no longer have the original cakes.

I am moderately curious why CD Dimensions has stopped carrying Falcon cdr’s (they still show the dvdr’s). I emailed Sam before placing the Discmakers order, & I didn’t receive a reply which is unusual.


#15

Your Plextor Premium can scan with PlexTools Professional (now a free download). IIRC your other Plextor drive is not capable of quality scanning.

As an alternative, you could use Alex Noé’s PxScan/PxView utilities.


#16

Thanks for the tip! Unfortunately, the current Plex Tools won’t run on Win 98 (fortunately I have several restore utilities on that box; it hosed windows completely!).

Any idea if Alex Noé’s PxScan/PxView is Win 98 compatible before I mess with it?

Unfortunately, it appears that neither Plex or Noe state minimum operating system.


#17

[QUOTE=MooMooMooMoo;2532811]Any idea if Alex Noé’s PxScan/PxView is Win 98 compatible before I mess with it?[/QUOTE] I have no idea, but it should be easy for you to find out simply by trying.


#18

[QUOTE=DrageMester;2532290]As other have said, DVD burners like the Optiarc AD-7220A that use MediaTek chipsets are not suitable for scanning CD media. The chipset only reports C1 failures (E31) and C2 failures (E32), where proper CD scanners report at least all C1 errors (E11+E21+E31) as well as C2 failures (E32).

So I wouldn’t depend on scans from that drive to determine which burns are good or which which burns are better than other burns. IMO you can only really use such scans to see which burns are really horrible - i.e. showing C2 failures.

The assertion that Falcon CD-R media is going downhill is therefore not only based on a single batch of discs, but it’s also based on flawed measurements.

So I wouldn’t conclude anything from the evidence at hand.[/QUOTE]

I remember when you first burst my bubble with how useless MTK chipset DVD drives were for scanning CDRs, too (in the CDR/RW tests forum I think!) :slight_smile:

One of my first TY CDR burns, 99 QS and a scan identical to the first scan in the OP. Scanning perfection…NOT! :sad: :stuck_out_tongue:

Lucky you have a Plex Premium on hand, MooMooMooMoo :)…when Drage gave me the bad news, I pulled out a Litey CDRW that I had tucked away.


#19

[QUOTE=MooMooMooMoo;2532773]
2. The current batch of Falcons are labeled “Falcon Media Pro”. I can’t tell you what the older batches I got from CD Dimensions were labeled, as I no longer have the original cakes.[/QUOTE]Falcon uses slightly different dyes among their CD-R offerings. I have found them all to burn at least very well at 16X on the 7200. See if you can get better(usable) burns with your AD-7200?

[QUOTE=MooMooMooMoo;2532773]
I am moderately curious why CD Dimensions has stopped carrying Falcon cdr’s (they still show the dvdr’s). I emailed Sam before placing the Discmakers order, & I didn’t receive a reply which is unusual.[/QUOTE]Sam left CdDimensions some time ago. His replacement has his own favorites and connections among media makers. We may not see quite as many Falcons available there in the future :sad:.


#20

[QUOTE=deanwitty;2532910]Falcon uses slightly different dyes among their CD-R offerings.[/QUOTE]

Do you know whether they use only the Ciba’s Irgaphor Ultragreen CD-R dye or also dyes from other manufacturers?