Mitsui Gold CDR Optimized Burning Strategy

vbimport

#1

As I bought a lot of Mame Gold Prostudio CDRs, I would like to ask if anybody has tried the manual burning strategies (Varitec) to improve the burning results.
Used burners are Plextor Premium and Plextor 712.

The problem is, that Mame Gold is not in the list of recommended or compatible media, thus I think Plextor has to find the optimized strategy by OPC.
The results are not bad, but could be better:
Burning at 8x or 16x brings the following results:
8x: c1 = 2,0 (average) and about 20-24 (max) testing at 10-24x
16x: c1 = 2,3 and about 25-30 testing at 10-24x.

I have burnt some CDRs, the results are quite the same (average c1).
Has someone tried a Varitec strategy?

When burning Taiyo Yuden (Plextor) CDRs, the c1 average error is in most cases about 0,5 (burning at 8 oder 16x).

Remarks on Tayo Yuden CDRs: Nearly all my TY-CDRs which I burnt between 1999 und 2001 have still c1 (average) errors of 0,5-0,7 and c1 max < 20.


#2

I assume that there were no C2 and no CU errors? Then your results of 30 max C1 are indeed very good results. Quality is important for me too and with C1 max = 30, even I wouldn’t worry :-). My Plextor Premium does his best burns @16x btw. Your results with TY media are outstanding results.

hth
weaker


#3

Mine outstanding results with TY:
Drive Info ID:0 PLEXTOR CD-R PREMIUM V1.05 Test Settings Read Speed: 10-24X CAV
Test Result Disc Info: AudioCD , 79:47.22 MSF
Avg/Sec Max/Sec Total
C1 0.3 9.0 1249.0
C2 0.0 0.0 0.0
CU 0.0 0.0 0.0

Test Duration 0:04:32
Backup of AudioCD. Verbatim Pastel disc.52X. Burned at 8X.



#4

My best result with TY CDR (Philips/Taiyo Y.) was c1 = 0,4/12, no c2 (test speed 10-24x).
It was burnt 5 years ago with an Philips Audioburner CDR 870 at 1x (a drive which allows to use PC-CDRs using some tricks :-).

@weaker

Of course c1 = 2,0/22 is not bad, but I expected better results from such expensive CDRs like Mitsui Gold, as Mitsui always was saying that its Dye is the best ever invented. c1=2,0 I get with most CDRs I used until now. But with the old TDK (manuf by TDK) und TY I hat much better results.
Thus I hope, the dye of Mitsui CDR stays as stable as TY.


#5

as Mitsui always was saying that its Dye is the best

Which manufacturer doesn’t claim this? :slight_smile:

Gruß :cool: (… und TY…) :bigsmile:
weaker


#6

The old Mitsui Gold Ultra II 24x was by far the best (and most expensive) media I ever used … it even could beat TY


#7

I have burnt now some Mame Gold at 4x instead of 8x and the results are 30% better. As I only use them for archiving audio, the low burning speed does not matter.
Now: c1 = 1,2/<18
I hope, the CDR is as longtime-stable as TY.

Lets see, if the audio standalone burner likes them too at 1x :slight_smile:
When I burn the first one, I will post the result.


#8

“Mitsui always was saying that its Dye is the best ever invented.”

Truth of the matter is they do use the most archival dyes, by far. Phthalocyanine dye does score the highest consistently on all in-depth testing. Joe Iraci from Canada recently published a study comparing the dyes/media.
Mitsui invented that phthalocyanine dye. Taiyo Yuden disk construction is superb but they use cyanine dye which is definitely less archival.
http://www.uni-muenster.de/Forum-Bestandserhaltung/downloads/iraci.pdf

Best
How786


#9

Which burner(s) was/were used in this study? He mentions only the devices that were used to measure the quality afterwards.


#10

Interesting, as I do prefer quality above speed. Till now used TY but I´ll wait some more test and/or informations about the Mitsui cd-r. Do quite a lot of music backup myself.


#11

Simple issue. TY DOES make superb CDs from the mechanical build standpoint but Mitsui has corenered the market thru its patent on the pthalocyanine dye. Few peeple realize this. All the Mitsui CDs are built in Colorado. The DVDs have had some inconsistant issues. So, for now, I’d be cautious with them.
I’m currently doing a photo archiving project. We make one copy on Mitsui Gold and another on TY to be safe.
Best
How786


#12

Interesting aging test, but I have many Phtalo-CDRs which are deteriorating rapidly each year (eg. some Fuji, nearly all EMTEC & many others…).
And the Taiyo Yuden are completely stable (now the oldest ones for 6 years with c1 average of 0,5-2,0!!).
Thus my believe in phtalo-CDRs is quite damaged :frowning:


#13

Are you sure that the Fuji are Phthalocyanine? Can you document that? My understanding is that Mitsui owns that patent and is the exclusive maker. I’ve got Mitsui Golds going back 7-8 years that are still perfect. (All their Gold CDS are made in Colorado, fyi)
Taiyo Yuden are decent…very well made. But, I recently tested them (this week) and compared them to the Mitsui Gold CDS. The Mitsui have far fewer BLER errors consistently. The TYs were acceptable but the Mitsui test results have been outstanding.


#14

i agree :iagree: same here.
but it´s important to say that cyanin don´t like extrem storage condition. (heat humidity)

here is an interessing link

it´s in german. maybe somebody with better english knowledge can translate it.

i also did a test by my own.

see attachments

unfortunately the #1 marked cd-r isn´t another cd-r
supply from the same packing as #2 guess what manufacturer? :rolleyes:

i was a little bit surprised, but only a little bit because #1 & #3 were laying @ a window for aprox 1,5 years. not a good idee





#15

Phtalocyanine is widely used by many manufacturers and is no garanty for good quality or longlivety.
But to answer your question:
Fuji:
http://www.cdr-forum.de/detailcdr.php?ID=1429

If a CDR uses phtalocyanine can bee seen by looking at the dye: the dye is clear (sometimes with a yellow or green shining)


#16

They are discussing this http://www.itl.nist.gov/div895/gipwg/StabilityStudy.pdf study.


#17

Cyanine dyes can be very robust as well, it all depends on the quality standard of the manufacturer. This is a scan (Plextor Premium 1.06) of some of the best CD media ever made, original TDK Reflex 650MB CDR with a blue cyanine dye. The disc was burned at 4x speed with a Yamaha 400T SCSI CD burner on August 6th 1998, that’s almost 8 years ago.





#18

i agree too

the 2 cd-r´s were
a ritek (platinum) and
the other one a Plextor (TY)
both bought 2003. 50 packing
What i try to say is that cyanin are ok too but if they are stored @ bad storage conditions they have potential more risk to become unreadable than phthalo.

But unfortunately it´s absolut correct that also phthalo can be unreadable very so too.

back in 1999 i bought cheap one.
first packing was multimedia master the other one princo.
the printing was absolut identical :a but they have a slight different color.
guess what cd-r died after only 6 month. :wink:

i also have TDK TY bought in ~99.
still excellent read ability in my Plextor premium. but they are not stored on the window board of course.