LG GSA-4160B Fw A302 not burning faster than 8X

Hi to everybody! I’ve searched for a couple of days every note that could solve my problem, but I didn’t find the solution… I have found many interesting suggestions, but… : :disagree:

The problem :
BRAND NEW dvd rewriter LG GSA-4160B Fw A302 not burning faster than 8X and not recording Princo media.

Hw :
AMD athlon 700, 393Mb Ram, 2HDDs 10Gb ATA66 UDMA both connected to MB Primary IDE.
LG GSA-4160B ATA 66 master on sec. IDE, LG DVD rom ATA33 slave on Sec. IDE.

Sw :
OS Windows XP Professional (No Service pack2)
NERO Ultra Edition 6.3.0.0
Cd-dvd speed ver.4.08 and ver. 2.10.2

media used :
sony dvd +rw 2x-4x (2,30 Euros each)
tdk dvd -rw 2x-4x (2,30 Euros each)
princo dvd -r 1x-4x & 1x-8x (0,30 Euro each!!!)
imation dvd -r 1x-8x (1,30 Euros each)
traxdata dvd -r 1x-8x (0,80 Euros each)
verbatim dvd +r 16x (0,60 Euros each!)

what’s weird is :
rec time 4x (5540 kb/S) estimated time : 14 min, effective 14 min
rec time 8x (11080 kb/s) estimated time : 6 min, effective 8 min
rec time 16x (22160 Kb/s) estimated time : 4 min, effective 26 min

What I can see about Read Buffer and Drive Buffer is:

at recording speed 4x : they’re both always more than 98%
at recording speed 8x : Read Buffer from 50% to 100%, Drive buffer 98% or more
at recording speed 16x: both buffers continuosly bottom up

The DVD Burner firmware release was initially A302. With this release Princo media had no chance to be recorded… Nero advised recording completed with success, but the data (or videos) were unreadable. All other media were recorded and readed with success.
Upgrading Fw to A306 (yes! the cinese/japanese one!!) has modified the situation…:
Princo media are now well recorded and are well readable.(!!!)
&
rec time 16x estimated time : 4 min, effective 19 min, saving 7 min rec time!!!.

Nero never notified the change in speed, that means that seems to rec at 16x but it’s obviously not true…!

I’ve tried to :
0. defrag HDDs

  1. look for problems with dma access for HDDs and DVD but seems OK.
  2. check HDDs speed with Nero and they’re more than 12x, 21486 Kb/sec HDD1 & 20080 KB/sec HDD2.
  3. disconnect LG DVD rom slave on sec. IDE
  4. reinstall nero
  5. Create Test DVD with a Sony -Rw 4x media, and all seems ok.
  6. Test Verbatim 16x transfer rate, and resulted in average read speed 9x (isn’t it slow??), and I think this is not affected by HDD transfer data speed. May it be because it was a video dvd affected by riplock?
  7. Copy a dvd from HDD1 to the HDD2, timing about 15 min. (but I really don’t remember).

Questions :
1- Ok if I have to rec at max 8x since I pay Verbatim only 0,60 Euro, but there is it really any problem with my LG GSA-4160B?
2- Is it there anybody experiencing real 16x rec on Verbatim 16x media with 4160B?
3- I may understand that for some reasons my pc is unfitted for 16x rec, 'cause of the HDDs (I’ve assembled it with garbage) but why is the rec time at 16x not only more than 8x, but even more than 4x? It could have been burning at 12x comparing transfer rates !!
4- May it be that trying to burn at 16x has bad impact on HDD performance so that the buffers can’t be correctly managed?
5- LG system requirements are greater than my Pc Hw… Does it really matters, since my CPU isn’t really busy when burning?
6- Is it there any outstanding dvd burner with low system requirements?
6- Should I upgrade my Via AMD chipset with other drivers than the microsoft XP ones?

Notes :
-Fw A306 seems to have resolved Princo media compatibility with my GSA-4160 and it is probably true for other media too.
-By now I can burn at max speed 8x… not so bad.
-I don’t think useful to switch HDDs & DVD from primary to secondary IDE and viceversa…(??)

Next tries (not in order) :

  • burn at 12x
  • downgrade Fw to A303 (last LG official release)
  • rec on Verbatim -r 16x
  • rec / test on expensive media suggested by LG
  • create dvd test media with Verbatim ±r 16x
  • test my dvd burner on another Pc with better performing HDD and/or better Hw.
  • change DVD recorder…!

Hoping I have been understandable enough, and that the steps I’ve followed to try solving my problem may help someone else.
Sorry if I won’t stay for a long time in forum but it’s getting late… I will for sure read any reply tomorrow…
Thank everybody for reading this and for any hardly wanted hint !!!
(Newbie) Nenepilot. :bigsmile:

Firstly uncheck the write check box so you don’t waste anymore discs while you are trying this out.

Then I would use nero’s “determine maximum speed” check box to see how fast your system can deliver the data, and whether or not it can deliver the data for a 16x burn.

I would also use the “simulation” check box, that way you can find out what your burn time will be without having to use another disc. It does everything that would happen in a burn except activating the laser. You will be able to see if your buffers a fluctuating violently indicating that your system cannot deliver the data fast enough. You will also see how your system will behave with different media.

If your system cannot burn at the speed requested it does slow down a to a speed it think it can use to make a successful burn. It is common for it to slows down more than if you originally selected the next slowest speed. In otherwords if you know your system cannot deliver 16x then choose 8x.

Z

Check if DMA is active. Most of times these issues are due to a drive running in PIO mode.

Welcome :slight_smile:
A lot of information for the first post :slight_smile:

Your CPU is a bit slot, your HDDs old, so they should be quite slow.

NERO Ultra Edition 6.3.0.0

Too old, but that should have no inpact on your performace problem.

rec time 4x (5540 kb/S) estimated time : 14 min, effective 14 min
rec time 8x (11080 kb/s) estimated time : 6 min, effective 8 min
rec time 16x (22160 Kb/s) estimated time : 4 min, effective 26 min

Your estimations are driven by marketing nonsence. The write speed a burner uses in marketing language is the maximum write speed, not the average write speed. Typicaly you should get 4x in 14-15 min, 8x in 8-9 min and 16x in about 6 min. Check a review for the 4160 for the exact times.

What I can see about Read Buffer and Drive Buffer is:

at recording speed 4x : they’re both always more than 98%
at recording speed 8x : Read Buffer from 50% to 100%, Drive buffer 98% or more
at recording speed 16x: both buffers continuosly bottom up

The DVD Burner firmware release was initially A302. With this release Princo media had no chance to be recorded…

Forget 16x burning on your PC. Princo media is cheap crap.

  1. check HDDs speed with Nero and they’re more than 12x, 21486 Kb/sec HDD1 & 20080 KB/sec HDD2.

As said before, this is too slow. Combined with a slow CPU you might have luck to burn at 12x, but I have strong doubts about this. 16x is impossible.

  1. Copy a dvd from HDD1 to the HDD2, timing about 15 min. (but I really don’t remember).

Source and target drive on the same IDE bus results in bad performance, even with faster PCs.

2- Is it there anybody experiencing real 16x rec on Verbatim 16x media with 4160B?

Your HDDs can not supply the neccessary data rate, and even if they could, your CPU is too slow.

3- I may understand that for some reasons my pc is unfitted for 16x rec, 'cause of the HDDs (I’ve assembled it with garbage) but why is the rec time at 16x not only more than 8x, but even more than 4x? It could have been burning at 12x comparing transfer rates !!

The extra rounds of DVD spinning cost extra time, especially if the data source is too slow all the time to fill the small 2 MB buffer.

4- May it be that trying to burn at 16x has bad impact on HDD performance so that the buffers can’t be correctly managed?

No, your disks are too slow. Some years ago I have made tests on a 10 GB IBM disk. The max. data rate was 12 MB/s at the outside of the HDD, but only 7 MB/s at the inner part of the disk. So depending where the data is stored, the data rate is too low, even on a defragmented drive. An empty 10 GB HD will be slower than an already half full HD, where you only use the outer 5 GB.

6- Is it there any outstanding dvd burner with low system requirements?

No.

Next tries (not in order) :

  • change DVD recorder…!

That will not solve your general PC performance problems for burning at higher speeds. Burn at 8x or get a faster PC.

What´s the big deal anyway of burning 16x and save 3 minutes? I personally use the burner only for backups, both personal (music, vids…) and professional as a backup device and can work, surf, whatever all the time the burn is in progress.
What I do most is let it take its time and read news or call a friend - sparetime for myself so to say, which is a good thing :wink:
I mean You got a slow computer and accept that, but are willing with great timely effort to save up time while burning…

OK! :cool:
Thank to everybody!
I will certainly try with Nero simulations… but I’m not sure it will work for video dvds…
I was quite sure it’s an Hw problem like ALA42 suggests, about HDDs… But you know, I was trying to figure out if I had a problem with my GSA-4160B or not.
Thank for the exaustive answers to my post to ALA42, and suggestion to Zforum69 & geno888. :clap:
I thank also seitenschneider for spending his time, even if He probably didn’t understand that I’m not interested in saving time but only in better knowing my HW.
I will try your suggestions.
Thanks folks! :bow:

True I didn´t get it that way :wink:
Good luck anyway, keep reading the forums.

Very nice and competent people here!

The hard drives will definitely be a problem. Most drives in that generation where only capable of around 15 megs per sec sustained actual DTR at best. Most of the next generation generation were capable of around 25-30 MB/sec, even for 5400 rpm stuff. What is the exact hard drive model? Defragging your hard drive would make the best of the situation, but you really need a faster hard drive.

That exactly what I found… :slight_smile:
Trying the DTR with Nero it comes 15Mb/s for the 7200 rpm HDD and 13,8 for the 5400 HDD.
Choosin’ Nero “Test speed” (Simulation not allowable, as I supposed for DVD video) and unchecking the “write” checkbox, it was told me that I could have write at 12x…
NO way!!! :rolleyes: I tried at 12x and it didn’t worked out…!!
As ALA42 predicted max speed for my Hw is 8x. :bow:
I’m not even sure that simply upgrading my HDD to a faster one will solve the problem… I will post my HDD models asap, just to be sure!
Thank you :clap:

Any chipset running an Athlon 700 will have a least ATA66 support. Current generation 7200 rpm drives (as long as DMA is enabled) sustain around 60-70 meg/secs peak so I don’t think it will be a problem.

Hello again! :smiley:
This is what I use… and it is all I can effort by now… :o
Report made by EVEREST v2.20.405
Processor type AMD Athlon, 700 MHz (7 x 100)
MB LuckyTech P6K7A (1 ISA, 5 PCI, 1 AGP, 1 AMR, 3 DIMM, Audio)
Chipset VIA VT8371 Apollo KX133
System memory 384 MB (PC133 SDRAM)
BIOS Award Modular (03/13/00)
HDD1 QUANTUM FIREBALLlct10 10 (10 GB, 5400 RPM, Ultra-ATA/66)
HDD2 QUANTUM FIREBALLP LM10.2 (10 GB, 7200 RPM, Ultra-ATA/66)
ODD HL-DT-ST DVDRAM GSA-4160B
SMART HDD state OK

Notice any strange thing about or 15Mb/s it’s ok?
You really think I may upgrade my HDD for better perfomance? (when I will have the money for!!.. :slight_smile: )

There’s any chance to edit the booktype with my lg gsa4160b? Is it true that max compatibility is using +R changing the booktype in -R? Are they going to be red in + and -R dvd player?

Just one more question… I found, reading in the forum about dvd media, that -R and +R are mostly the same thing… But I was thinking that +R are capable of more error correction plus all the other feature they have… but maybe I’m wrong.
I also red that time duration is unpredictable… depending on how the media are stored and managed… But, for example, if I have burned a PRINCO :Z perfectly (now with A306 fw it’s reality) and in the same way a Verbatim, is it the PRINCO going to degrade first?

Thank you… many nice and competent people here. :bigsmile:

a.)8x is ca. 11MB/s, 16x is ca. 22MB/s. When your HDD-speed-max is 15MB/s you never reach 16x, and with 8x you will have a problem, too, when the HDD is fragmented or on the inner tracks. And -R will not faster burned as 8x with the 4160

b.) I guess you can change the booktype with Nero in the recorder-properties DVD+R to DVD-Rom, not +R to -R.

c.) +R have in theory the better error-correction, but nobody had it prooved in real-world-using.

d.) Yes. Princo is very bad media (and will not so good burned like Verbatim), Verbatim is very reliable media.

Thanks folks. Keep reading this post… if someone will add something new! :stuck_out_tongue: