How should lacquer be applied on DVDs?

I know how lacquer (I am talking about the substance that protects the disc’s side) was supposed to cover CDs (from the top side downward) but how should a good coat of lacquer look on a DVD ? I’ve seen many forms, from (apparently) two layers, each covering the higher and respectively the lower ‘half’ of the disc, or one layer applied on the separation line - usually not doing the best job, or just the top half covered, to sometimes no lacquer at all :eek: (mostly on cheap discs) However I’ve never seen a top brand disc, like a good TY, Mitsui, MIS Verbatim etc.
So, how should a good coat of lacquer be applied on a DVD ?

MBI is famous for applying no lacquer to their CD media.
I’m not sure, actually, my MEI DVD-RW MIJ discs have one layer applied on the separation line while CMC-made TTH02 has the layer from the top. At first glance my YUDEN000 T03 seem to have quite a lot of lacquer covering almost everything. My YUDEN000 T02 seem to be inconsistant but still have lots of lacquer on the sides.
I don’t think Mitsui is good anyway, since they don’t really exist anymore. There’s still MAM-A, but I don’t think they make anything really good.

Are there any studies or ‘documented opinions’ on the extent of protection offered by the lacquer layer to the integrity of the recording, on both short and long term ? In short, how much is media lifespan shortened if the lacquer is applied defectively ?

I only know that no lacquer can cause the silver or aluminum to “rust” making the disc unreadable.
TY has really nicely polished lacquer… And it’s even cheaper than TDK-MBI discs :slight_smile:

TY has really nicely polished lacquer” that’s very good, but you find them so hard in my area that you’d say they’re infested with bird flu or something :slight_smile:
That’s why I’m also interested in the effects of lacquer (or lack thereof) on organic dye write-once media, like MIT Verbatims which are plentiful yet sometimes ‘lack’ in this department :slight_smile:

Oops… Only the TY CD-R have the polished lacquer, the pastels which I used do, but the Fuji YUDEN000 T02 and the TDK YUDEN000 T02 seem quite inconsistant there :frowning:
I only know that rusting/oxydation issue, maybe somebody else knows more…?

It’s puzzling how such a (potentially) important issue, although not a pressing one, is so rarely mentioned all over the community, while other important aspects like dye quality, writer and strategy compatibility etc. are intensely and pertinently debated.
I think it’s mostly due to the trade secret aspect of the matter, a lot of companies probably wouldn’t like people to know that their manufacturing solution is flawed and the aging test results dindn’t turn out that great… Or could it be that the DVD structure which encapsulates the dye between the two polycarbonate discs protects it well enough so that the lacquer layer isn’t vital anymore ? (hopefully the latter is true, but usually we’re not that lucky :)) I wonder if that Lifetime Warranty given by Verbatim covers their MIT, MII, MIC discs :rolleyes:

No, since the metal is also on the edge of the disc, only covered by the possibly non-existant lacquer. And as we know, rust finds its way… :frowning:
Verbatim is famous for their Lifetime Warranty but when was the last time you’ve actually seen it mentioned on their packaging? The last packaging on which I’ve actually seen it was a Verbatim 3x DVD-RAM, single jewel case.

So nobody knows much about this subject, apparently…

Well, id imagine to do this you would need a special machine, to stop siding of the laquer, and putting the disk of balance, also you would have to make sure you didnt increase the size of the disc, otherwise the disk could break inside the dvd player. Also you would have to make sure you didnt apply too much to the bottom of the disk, otherwise the laser could miss data on the disk… its not really a good idea to do it, its just too much effort. Just buy some high quality media.

The full title of the thread would be, “How should lacquer be applied on DVDs by the manufacturer”, for those wondering… :doh:

ohhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhhh… now it makes sense…

Usually the lacquer is applied automatically during manufacture by squirting a ring of lacquer onto a slowly rotating disc near the hub. The disc is then spun to move the liquid evenly across the disc before being hardened by ultra violet lamps. This is done in clean rooms just after the aluminium layer has been deposited, for obvious reasons. All the processes are automated to maintain quality output.

[B]*** Please read the post before replying ***[/B]
And the purpose of the thread is: which manufacturers / patterns / quantities are better and ensure a long lifespan for the media :slight_smile: I am, again, referring to the lacquer protecting the side of the disc.

Anyway, besides the top manufacturers it seems that most others have some problems in this regard, so the question really becomes: does a defective or incomplete lacquer lead to a significant shortening of the disc’s life ? If so, does it happen regardless of the environment or do external factors like humidity, excessive temperature etc. need to be present for the effect to become noticeable ?

[QUOTE=Lonely Bit][B]*** Please read the post before replying ***[/B]
And the purpose of the thread is: which manufacturers / patterns / quantities are better and ensure a long lifespan for the media :slight_smile: I am, again, referring to the lacquer protecting the side of the disc.
Anyway, besides the top manufacturers it seems that most others have some problems in this regard, so the question really becomes: does a defective or incomplete lacquer lead to a significant shortening of the disc’s life ? If so, does it happen regardless of the environment or do external factors like humidity, excessive temperature etc. need to be present for the effect to become noticeable ?[/QUOTE

To answer your question, yes an incomplete or damaged lacquer layer will cause premature failure of the disc.
I did read your post in your first entry last sentence you wrote "So, how should a good coat of lacquer be applied on a DVD?
I suggest that if you want succinct answers you write exactly what you are enquiring about.
If you have no idea what a good layer looks like I suggest that you use a good strong magnifier under strong light and use your own judgement.
This of course means that you have to look at a variety of media from the poorest to the best. If you can’t be bothered to do that then just buy quality media like TY or Verbatim as recommended by numerous people on the board.
If you have a batch of discs that look dodgy then get a refund.

Problem solved. :slight_smile:

If you can’t remember three sentences down the page so as to understand what I am talking about, you shouldn’t read long posts. If you think answering other people’s questions makes you better understand your own you should try a group. Also, when posting, you should bring valid arguments and relevant facts to support your claims; otherwise it all turns into idle afternoon chatting from which no solid conclusion can be drawn, or sought. Personal and uneducated judgement is never relevant when technical or scientific issues are at hand; I have seen countless patterns of lacquer through all kinds of instruments, yet I cannot draw any conclusion other than that some of them look better than others, which is merely an intriguing observation and thus reason for further inquiry. Before advising somebody to take an action one should do it himself; had you done that you would have known that many Verbatims also have an incomplete band of lacquer, while TY are not easily available in most parts of the world. Case closed.

If anybody actually knows something about the subject he is invited to speak his mind, otherwise I fear it will come down to how to make your own dvds and other original ideas.

Who do you think you are?
You no nothing about me so where does “uneducated judgement” come from?
As a production and measurement standard engineer I have no need to enquire into the manufacturing process, it is a fact over which neither you nor I have any control unless we were the engineer in charge. The cost/quality of the process is well known and will not change any time soon.
If you have a better method I suggest you patent it and sell it for the big bucks that it would be worth.
I also suggest that if you cannot be civil that you should go to a board where rudeness is the norm.

I’m not sure of that one to my dumb suprise the Imation CD-r’s which I got from school do show that a material which was once viscous has poured a long the sides. Lacquer ??? I don’t know but it looks like it !
So maybe some MBIL disc’s do come with lacquer ? :confused:

As we know, imations are also CMC. I just saw that some of my TDK CD-R made by MBI have a tiny little bit of lacquer, actually not all of them seem to have the side covered with lacquer, but maybe I just had bad luck.

Checked more MBIL media.

Imation 32x - NO
MMORE - NO
EMTEC RED - NO
TDK -NO

Verbatim DATALIFE PLUS - ?? TRACES

EMTEC CERAM GUARD 24x - SHOWS clearly a material which was once viscous has poured a long the sides.
Imation 52x -SHOWS a material which was once viscous has poured a long the sides.

Hmm I’m puzzled. Maybe 2 standards ???