How does bonding effect discs?

Hmm… at least in backwards Europe the DVD-R/DVD+R ratio is more like 2:1 or even 1:1. And most drives have better +R support.
Do they still use DVD-R for Authoring? Does this format actually still exist? DVD-R has the disadvantage of burner identification.

DVD-R for authoring still exists… but it’s on the way out. One of my workplace’s sister companies still uses it for DVD authoring.

As for DVD+R, Europe likes them better because the DVD+RW alliance managed to get a smaller levy put on them then exists for DVD-R.

Off-topic discussion moved into a separate thread: DVD-R burner identification

Because Philips is European?
MMCD = DVD+R = Blu-Ray Disc = Philips and Sony… see a pattern here? :wink:
I don’t see any price difference between DVD+R and DVD-R…

If there is a price difference in EU, it is more towards -R media which has always seemed to me to have a greater choice of media aswell.

The fact that TY has bonding issues (compared to Maxell etc) is nothing new. It is something which is said from the very beginning of TY DVD-R discs (well at least in Japan) but it is also said that these issues are getting better. The reason seems to be that MO use the same bonding procedure and Maxell and others have their experience from the MO days while TY had absolutely no knowledge in the bonding of Discs. It seems that Maxell has the highest quality in Bonding (well that is what I heard at various shops in Akihabara).
I myself never had any issues with TYs splitting into half but I had some problems with Mitsubishi/Verbatim made ones where the disc inside the Jewell case was broken into two (I bought 4 10packs of 8x DVD-R MIS and 8 discs were splitted into half) before opening them. This happened about 2 years ago.

Hrm. Interesting that you find Maxell to be the best bonded. In my experience, Maxell is, in general, bonded quite poorly, worse than TY on average for sure. This is based on a number of consumer grade spindles which are really quite bad, and a single spindle of Plus Series (higher grade) which has better bonding, but still not good.

Sorry I forgot to add that I mean MIJ Maxells. I dont know how the MIT Maxells etc are…

Nope, I’m talking about MIJ Maxells. :frowning:

Keep in mind you’re talking about Maxell “made in Japan” sold in North America, and he’s talking about Maxell “made in Japan” sold in Japan :wink:

Is there any big difference in Maxell MIJ in Japan and North America sold under the Maxell Brand??

Maxell would sell their best media in Japan (most companies do), and they can afford to because the prices in Japan are much higher.

Well we get alot of questionable Maxell under the regular Maxell banner… bad bonding, not so great scans. I would imagine $0.54 Plus Series though should be close to what is sold in Japan… but it scans fairly well and bonding isn’t good either.

$0.54? is that CAD or USD?

Either way it’s not that expensive for media, It cost more for my last batch of 16x TY.

$0.60 CAN/$0.54 US for white thermal 8X DVD-Rs while on sale. Yeah, not extremely expensive, but very close to twice the price of Verbatim.

It’s not total myth, but it’s not necessarily true either, not to the extent it’s being overblown into. Discs like this would usually be relegated to the secondary grade market, sold as “value” or “budget” or overprint media. TY value media would be a place this could happen.

But a truly bad disc would more often end up recycled or destroyed, not sold off with the other cheaper seconds. If there are TY out there which fell apart for whatever reason, it’s probably a combination of bad luck and other mitigating circumstances. I’ve never really seen this or heard much about it, and TY sells by the ton.

All discs have sloppier batches (many thousands of discs). Most often, when glue is the shoddy work, it tends to spill over some. I’ve seen bumpy Maxell discs to sticky Sony discs. The discs are not 100% perfect, but they’re not bad either. Some of those companies don’t have a secondary grade of disc, so they use them all in their main supply. Because, as I said a minute ago, they’re not bad discs, just not 100% perfection.

When you have customers only willing to pay you 30 cents each, and they whine for cheaper still, you’re not going to waste anything that may still be good, just because it’s bumpy or sticky.

He he… :bigsmile: :iagree: I also find this (that customers always want cheaper discs) paradoxical.

When I started burning DVDs last year, I was startled that burning 4 quality discs bought in street shops (that were quite expensive compared to online shops) was less expensive than a single blank 240mn VHS. So, 2 movies + 2 backup discs for safety, with great picture/sound quality, instead of 1 single shoddy VHS.
Now, for the price of the same VHS, and buying my media online, I can burn up to 12 Verbatim MCC004 discs!

You said it in another post a couple of months ago: we are spoiled. I so agree. There’s a real lack of perspective from the people who complain about optical media price. I would gladly pay $1.50 for a single disc if quality and long lifespan was guaranteed. And I’m sad that because of the market and customer pressure for low prices, quality will eventually drop (if it’s not already the case). :frowning:

Did You notice that many discs are not bonded in the center hub?
I separated a TDK with my fingernails and noticed this. TY(02-03)
and TDKs(TTG) have actually no bonding whatsoever in the centre.
I tried to pull apart a Ritek but I couldn’t. Only in the centre,You can
seperate the two using a needle or something.
I learned that most DVDs are not bonded there, any form of liquid
(not to mention oxygen) can reach the silver part pretty easily (but
not the dye).
Some manufacturers do claim to use 100% bonding for physical reasons
(like preventing discs to fall apart)
http://www.mam-a.com/technology/technical_papers/documents/bonding.htm
[I]"(…)liquid adhesive all the way into the clear center of the disc providing
superior strength. Our competitors use a heat sensitive adhesive applied
only to the data area."[/I]

Koba, Maxell sells discs in Japan that seem to be from two totally different production lines the same as in the US. All one needs to do is compare the inner hub serials. The really good discs have short serials like M5FA314A while the others have long serials like N6271001500107524. One of the most noticeable differences between the two types comes from doing ECC scanning. The Maxells with the longer serials invariably have many more total PIFs than the others. You can see this for yourself here. Not that the post the autor of the site links to on the description of the Hirobiro Bihaku-label MXLRG03 was made by myself on his BBS :stuck_out_tongue:

Two Degrees> Thanks for the info. Now the big problem would be how to look for the ones with the short serial number before purchasing the discs.
Maxell seems to have a lot of different lines with variable quality…