DVD Decrypter 3.1.7.0 - PUOs

Any reason to preserve PUOs? I only ask because I notice that they’re not removed by default, making me wonder if there’s some reason why one would want to keep the prohibitions in place. If this is a newbie question just let me know. Thanks.

Because they stop you doing things you shouldnt. This gives you a better copy and leads to less problems.
By all means, turn them back on, but if you have problems with things happening that dont happen on the original, you’ll know why :slight_smile:

That seems like a pretty lame and illogical answer. You make it sound like if someone disables the PUOs, that the player will actually know to do something different because the movie expects them. Nope. We shouldn’t be suggesting to people that the reason their copy is no good is because they disabled the PUOs (as opposed to some other infinitely more likely reason, like buffer overrun). When they re-enable the PUOs and burn again, assuming nothing has changed, they will likely get a second coaster. Nice. :cool:

Umm, Light offered the correct answer. They are usually there for a reason, and that is why they are preserved. Removing the PUOs doesn’t destroy your DVD, you are just now able to screw up the playback with the touch of a button. Also, PUOs have nothing to do with burn method, he never said that if you got a coaster turn your PUOs back on to solve the problem. This was a general question and he offered a general answer. Don’t make off the wall assumptions and flame the guy who gave you this great program to begin with.

/MLS

calling the guy who created DVD Decrypter “lame and illogical.” nice. :cool:

Let’s see if I can avail myself to some mercy via logic.

The initial question was from an apparent newbie (he wasn’t sure whether it was a newbie question), therefore a general response to a pointed question regarding why the setting is not default to remove PUOs is somewhat out of place. It should be a fairly pointed answer, not a general answer (“if you have problems with things happening that dont happen on the original, you’ll know why” would not explain why my disc causes my player to skip and/or bail due to a burn error – a reasonable reason why this question might be asked by a newbie - and when I re-burn after turning PUO’s back on with everything else exactly the same I get another coaster). “Because they stop you from doing things you shouldn’t?” Or do they only stop you from controlling the disc in a way that was not originally designed/intended? Do they prevent you from doing things you want to do, or do they spontaneously cause something to happen that results in (e.g. authoring) “problems?” “This gives you a better copy?” or does it simply gives you a less user-friendly copy? “Leads to less problems?” or makes it such that a user can’t dictate what the player does with the disc? What is a “better copy?” What are the “problems” that would be lessened?

“By all means, turn them back on” makes it sound like they were already on at some point in the past. Willb3d’s question was, more or less, why were PUOs not removed by default. In my (humble?) opinion, his question is still unanswered. So, I will re-ask the question that I believe he wanted to know (and very appropriately, it is directed toward the author): Why are the PUO’s not disabled by default? The answer to that question is not because they stop you from doing things you shouldn’t (the question was about the reason they are not removed by default, not what is the function of the PUOs). The answer could be that the author thought more people would want them than didn’t, or perhaps the author thinks he knows best what the users need. All I was pointing out is that the answer seemed lame and illogical. I think I have now substantially supported that theory and subjugated both the weak theory that I flamed the author, and the weaker theory that his answer adequately addressed the question. And, my own personal opinion, I think the default should be to remove them, as I wager more people want them removed than not.

By all means I have no intention of flaming anyone. My response was not posted without at least some thought. And there certainly is no defamatory comments directed at an individual. Note my comments are directed at the answer (which could have been given by anyone). I also note that there are those quick to jump to “off the wall” conclusions about my comment without thinking or analyzing. More likely, one notified the other after reading my post instead of cogitating about what was actually written in all posts. And I hardly think that being able to skip the FBI screen and previews would “screw up the playback with the touch of a button.”

Now to bring additional honor to DVD Decrypter and its author: this program is quite simply put, easy to use, comprehensive, and free. The last thing I would want would be to discourage the further development and creation of tools like this (although this is hardly the first or only program of its kind, and also contains code created by others). I no longer use any other program for the purposes that it serves. To continue to enhance the perception of the application and its author, I posted a comment that should be construed as constructive criticism, which a good programmer is usually more than willing to receive. I didn’t see the author making statements in his defense, and maybe his perfunctory initial response, or the lack of one to my comment, is due to his likely hectic schedule. Perhaps he simply did not deem my comment worthy of a response. Regardless, the program is sweet, and my comments easily stand on their own merit.

Oh No , you must leave the puo’s in!!!, otherwise you might press the buttons that.
1)Stop time
2)supernova the sun or
3)elect a labour government

Dont mess with them!!!:stuck_out_tongue:

Taz0mania:

I think you make valid points and redeem yourself with admirable aplomb.:slight_smile:

The whole issue of PUOs is interesting (my euphemism for confusing). Some are clearly there to force you to read the copyright warnings, for instance. Some others may indeed exist to prevent the DVD recursing to the point where it disappears up its own jacksie.

Even after DVD Decrypter has done its work, there are programs further down the line which will also remove these switches (and didn’t InstantCopy even allow you selectively to enable the different kinds?)

Lightening! is erring on the side of caution: if you leave the things in your new disc will at least behave the same way as the original, assuming nothing else has screwed up matters.

Personally, I always output the transcoded files to the hard drive and test them there before burning, and I have to say I have never encountered problems from disabling PUOs…

-Pete

The problem is having strip PUOs on by default MAKES NO SENSE. If Joe-Newbie goes to copy his disc, he will be just fine with PUOs on, and no new problems will arise. If you’re advanced enough to know what PUOs are you can turn them off for yourself, easy as that. Should the default option be set to something that has the potential to cause problems, or to something that will NEVER cause problems? Again, it makes no sense to have that option on by default.

I don’t see any redeption in your explanation really, the initial poster asked, “Is there a reason to preserve PUOs?” The correct answer is “Yes, there is.” Lets assume he would follow with, “Why?” The correct answer is: “Because 9 times out of 10 they are there to stop you from screwing up the normal functionality of your DVD by stopping you from activating an option you wouldn’t normally be able to activate.” That, to me, sounds quite a bit like what Light said. Obviously skipping the FBI screen is not going to screw up your DVD, but this is only ONE of MANY different PUOs in place. No, you may not notice any change in functionality with them off, thats fine, you just happen to not be hitting any buttons that would normally screw up your playback. Unfortunately, not everyone will have the same experience.

Hopefully this is clearer?

/MLS

In other words, if you know what you’re doing or want to experiment, go ahead and try disabling some or all of them.
Otherwise, leave them alone.

True of most things I’d say.

-Pete

PS I take issue with your ‘9 out of 10’ statistics. I don’t accept that statement for one minute. If there was a 90% chance of ruining each DVD’s functionality by disabling the PUOs I’d have seen it by now, and I haven’t.

Originally posted by Peter McCall
PS I take issue with your ‘9 out of 10’ statistics. I don’t accept that statement for one minute. If there was a 90% chance of ruining each DVD’s functionality by disabling the PUOs I’d have seen it by now, and I haven’t.

It was an arbitrary figure I pulled out of my head, it wasn’t meant to be a proven statistic. What I meant was… That most of the user prohibitions in place on the DVD are there to protect you from yourself, and not to force you to watch the FBI logos, previews, etc. Pretend I said ‘most’ instead of 9 out of 10. :slight_smile:

/MLS

Thanks, Pete. I might also add that an extremely small percentage of people are ripping a DVD straight to a DVD burner – especially those DVDs that are larger than 4.7gig. So, given that MOST people are ripping to their hard drive first, I think we can conclude that MOST people are examining their ripped files just like you and me. Likely something like DVD Shrink is being used next.

In reality, I do understand that there are features on some DVDs where you interact with a special features section that may require you to select an answer from several options during trivia questions, or select a direction to go in an interactive game, etc. These may have timing elements that the designer might want to impose for the purposes of requiring a specific answer or a specific movement limited to a particular segment of time. I saw the latter in my daughter’s Beauty and the Beast. You try to get to the red rose and must move as objects come toward you. If this is what MLS is trying to explain, fine. But it still does not address the original question, and it would be quite a stretch to believe that the person asking the original question was curious about this aspect of PUO use, especially when he referred to them as prohibitions.

It is probably a safe assumption that the original question was asked AFTER the person had ripped a DVD and either played it on the computer or actually burned it to DVD and played it on a player. Either way, the PUOs then irritated him because he was not able to FF right to the movie to see whether the software worked or not. After a bit of research to find out what might be causing the problem, finally discovering that it was the PUOs, then locating the information that explained how and where to turn the PUOs off, he finally realized that it was those two check boxes that were not checked by default. Next logical step, ask why the author wasted his F-ing time by not checking it by default. The original question was likely asked out of some anger (although it was courteous) that it wasn’t checked by default, and not finding any information as to why they might want to be kept, asked. The answer from the author might as well been: “To keep idiots like you from creating a PUO-less DVD rip.” Again, the author’s statement was: “but if you have problems with things happening that dont happen on the original, you’ll know why” is slightly misleading because the only way “things happening that don’t happen on the original” would occur is if you are pressing buttons during playback – and even then, the author would have to assume that the user would have NO IDEA what should happen if they press, say, the FastForward button during a preview.

MLS, I am still trying to figure out what the “new problems” are in your reply “…with PUOs on, and no new problems will arise.” The initial poster did ask “Any reason to preserve PUOs?” more likely because he finally figured out that he wanted them removed, and was pissed because he had to figure it all out – not because he DIDN’T KNOW WHAT THEY DID! He clearly knew what they did when he referred to them as prohibitions. What kind of options are you referring to when you wrote: “activating an option?” And how many people will be upset because they were able to bypass PUOs vs. those that would be perfectly fine with it (hence the original question, why not disable by default). As far as your 9 out of 10 statistic, “most” is not even accurate. I don’t even think you can say 1 out of 10. Perhaps you should give us a statistic of the actual number of problems you have run up against vs. your total rip count. Right now, I can say mine is 0 out of about 60. And I certainly don’t have enough time to watch many movies (and there are very few I would watch more than once), so my total rip number has to be lower than many DVD-ripping enthusiasts.

Bottom line, the original post was likely an indirect, courteous way of asking the author to disable the PUOs by default in the software if there was no critical reason for it to be otherwise (of course the option to keep them is still there). If he chooses to do that or not, that is up to him. We still love him and his software either way. :bow:

You know its time to quit arguing when you’re forced to repeat yourself to make your point. Expect no further discussion from me here.

/MLS

It wouldn’t be so bad if you weren’t repeating mis-information that has yet to address the questions. That is lame and illogical in and of itself to the observers until you show otherwise. I am still wondering why there is so much beating around the bush concerning the original question. Everyone is so eager to explain what PUOs do (and accurate information has yet to be provided by some), and not a single person that has posted here has asked for that information (we all already know). Sometimes I wonder why some people repeatedly post without reading and without apparent knowledge.

Bruce Almighty…dang I wish I was God and could skip those previews but tried as I might I couldn’t and had to wait like 3 mins just to get to the menu. Thus a good reason to backup it up and watch it from the backup instead of the original. Disney is a notorious violator of using PUOs to the maximum extent allowed by law.

Quite. And this is another reason I remove the PUOs, and one of the reasons I always include a few Disney DVDs when beta testing.

#Zip-a-dee-doo-dah, zip-a-dee-ay
My, oh my, what a terrible way
To author a disc and get in my way
Zip-a-dee-doo-dah, zip-a-dee-ay#

-Pete

PUO abuse is tantamount to customer abuse. Did I pay for the PUOs…or the movie? And just exactly what difference does the delay make to the bootlegger? Is he actually using the argument as a defense in court? “Your Honor, I accidentally fast-forwarded through the 10-second FBI warning (and thankfully skipped all the previews, as well) and didn’t know I couldn’t mass produce copies for resale. Therefore, please dismiss all charges.” Frankly, the PUOs are predominantly a nuisance to DVD consumers, and should be set to be removed by ‘Decryptor by default. And if some sycophantic sadomasochist (MLS?) wants to put them in, “by all means, turn them ‘back’ on…” :cool:

I might note (for all of those that might be alerted when someone posts here), I just noticed DVDShrink has PUOs disabled by default during rip; one less reason to use DVD Decrypter. I have to reconfigure Decrypter each upgrade.

I’ll also note that not a single post here lists a single specific example where the absence of PUOs created a problem. I have listed a reason why it might, but did not test the theory. Perhaps anyone that actually knows something about this (or has an example) can enlighten us. Until then…

try to backup the matrix disabling puos, then press as many buttons as you can… might turn out to be funny…
i disabled them as well, and anyway i don’t see any reason (not one) to turn them back on.

If the first screen that appears on dvd playback is a language selection screen and you have PUD’s dissable, you can actually jump directly to the Menu without selecting a language. But since you didnt select one, the default langauge will show and that may not be readable to you. PUD’s being on do have their place to stop people doing stupid things.

Other than similar situations like that, I see no reason to leave turn PUD’s on.