DVD burning rings - help

My LG GWA 4164 has been burning rings in my dvd’s at 4x write speed lately (14 dvd’s and counting - toast!) I’m using firmware D108 on a Dell 5150. I’ve been reading lots about people upgrading the firmware with no solution.
Oh, I’m using DVD shrink to an image then burning with Nero 7 .

The problem is that when I insert a Fujifilm 8x disc, it only gives me the option of 4x and sometimes the 8x and 4x option is there if i eject and reinstert a few times, at which I select the 8x burn because it will work. But when the 4x option is the only option available I get those annoying bad sector rings (bad TOASTED - DVD).

I’ve tried Sony 16x made in japan discs and most of the time the full options are there 16x 12x 8x 4x. Even those discs occasionally give an option of 4x but if I eject and put it back in I will sometimes get the 16x option back. With the options available I can successfully burn at 16x although I dare not try 4x. So far when 4x is the only option available I’ve destroyed the dvd’s.

What i’ve noticed is the only time the full write options are given is when i insert the DVD and you can hear the drive spool up, if it doesn’t I’m only going to get the 4x option which I know destroys my dvd - gives me a bad burn.

Is it my drive? I’ve noticed a lot of people having similar problems with the same drive. DMA is enabled.

Sorry can’t help as I don’t know your drive, but do you use to ask Nero to test before burning?
If you do it, maybe you can avoid some coasters.

Test? Not sure how to test a blank DVD with Nero. How do I do it?

As you say you are using Nero 7 I’m not that sure because still use version 6, but I assume it is not that different.
When you Nero Burning Rom, not the Express fast way, before you burn the disc and in the same window where you can see the speeds you must have some choices: test, burn and test+burn.
If you ask it to test the burning it will simulate the all process and return the indication that the burn will not be accomplished, if it considers that your problem will prevent a correct burning process.

This happens within the full version of Nero. OEM versions offer different falvours and I can’t exclude that some of them are short of the required facilities.
If so, I guess you can allways check if you can test with a trial version - valid for 30 days.

Okay I’ll try the test first but I don’t think it will solve my problem.

I did a test burn on a dvd+rw – bad mistake – the disc will play okay but now the light keeps flashing.

Sounds like a classic sign of your drive going bad. Happened to one of my drives on an older PC and when I put in a newer BenQ 1650 or 1655, problem was gone :wink:

I found out my enable recording box was unchecked so it was having difficulty reading the DVD+RW. Nero erased the disc fine and I reformatted and it was okay.

The option to write at 16x with Sony DVD-R are becoming very rare. I keep checking to see if the option is there but it seems rare, sometimes it’s available (but seems only for 1 disc). Sometimes if I restart my computer it’s available but not always. Maybe there’s an update or security patch by microsoft that’s screwing it up? Unfortunately I’m unable to restore my computer beyond the 3 month max. :frowning:

And the firmware update for the LG GWA-4164B, by many users, hasn’t been found useful at all to clear up the burning rings so I suspect the drive. Or perhaps the lens is dirty? Conflicting drivers? It says it’s working okay but I’m also using Sonic (similar to Roxio), Ulead DVD movie factory and Capwiz which may have nothing to do with it at all. :confused:

Maybe the laser is dying? Maybe it’s just a fact of bad design, overheated controller/laser and permanent damage? [guessing …]

Some drives display the wrong speed when they have problems READING the manufacturer info off the disc, or they sense a problem with the laser power. Alternatively, maybe an IDE cable issue? try replugging it or using a new one? Or maybe an IDE controller issue altogether [i’ve had that with USB timings screwing burners up] … what IDE controller are you using? (Hopefully not NF based)

I’ll check the IDE controller when I get home from work. I’m also going to run a dvd cleaner disc on the drive to see if that helps. It almost seems that there is something in the way near the centre of the disc. Maybe it could be a dust build up problem with that drive that everyone is having.

I’m also going to try the discs in another drive to see if they can be written at 8x or 16x speed. That way I can rule out the media and not my system, but I have a feeling it has nothing to do with the media.

The controllers: from device manager
IDE ATA/ATAPI controllers
Intel® 82801GB Serial ATA Storage Controllers
Intel® 82801GB Ultra ATA Storage Controllers
Primary IDE Channel
Primary IDE Channel
Secondary IDE Channel

Do you need more info to see if it is NF based ?

And this is what Nero cd/dvd speed displays with the same fujifilm 8X dvd+r

Nero CD-DVD Speed: Disc Info
Basic Information
Disc Type: : DVD+R
Book Type : DVD+R
Manufacturer: : Ritek
MID : RITEK R03 (002)
Write speeds: : 4 X
Blank Capacity : 4.38 GB
: 4482 MB
: 4700375040 bytes
Extended Information
Layers : 1
Write strategies : 4 X - 8 X
Disc Status : Empty
Raw Data
Physical Format Information (00h)
0000 - A1 0F 02 00 00 03 00 00 00 26 05 3F 00 00 00 00 - …&.?..
0010 - 00 00 03 52 49 54 45 4B 00 00 00 52 30 33 02 38 - …RITEK…R03.8
0020 - 23 54 37 20 00 5D 6C 00 B2 67 15 15 0B 0B 08 08 - #T7…]l…g…
0030 - 01 19 1B 0C 0C 0C 0D 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 - …
0040 - 01 00 38 38 00 31 66 1C 06 2E 23 10 04 1E 1D 01 - …88.1f…#…
0050 - 00 00 00 31 66 1C 06 2E 23 10 04 1E 1D 01 00 00 - …1f…#…
0060 - 02 00 54 70 00 33 67 64 1F 10 0A 0A 00 20 00 00 - …Tp.3gd…
0070 - 00 00 00 43 62 75 1F 10 0A 07 00 20 00 00 00 2A - …Cbu…*

Nero CD-DVD Speed: Disc Info
Basic Information
Disc Type: : DVD+R
Book Type : DVD+R
Manufacturer: : Ritek
MID : RITEK R03 (002)
Write speeds: : 4 X - 8 X
Blank Capacity : 4.38 GB
: 4482 MB
: 4700375040 bytes
Extended Information
Layers : 1
Write strategies : 4 X - 8 X
Disc Status : Empty
Raw Data
Physical Format Information (00h)
0000 - A1 0F 02 00 00 03 00 00 00 26 05 3F 00 00 00 00 - …&.?..
0010 - 00 00 03 52 49 54 45 4B 00 00 00 52 30 33 02 38 - …RITEK…R03.8
0020 - 23 54 37 20 00 5D 6C 00 B2 67 15 15 0B 0B 08 08 - #T7…]l…g…
0030 - 01 19 1B 0C 0C 0C 0D 01 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 00 - …
0040 - 01 00 38 38 00 31 66 1C 06 2E 23 10 04 1E 1D 01 - …88.1f…#…
0050 - 00 00 00 31 66 1C 06 2E 23 10 04 1E 1D 01 00 00 - …1f…#…
0060 - 02 00 54 70 00 33 67 64 1F 10 0A 0A 00 20 00 00 - …Tp.3gd…
0070 - 00 00 00 43 62 75 1F 10 0A 07 00 20 00 00 00 2A - …Cbu…*

Both are the same disc. I just opened the drive and closed it (leaving the disc where it is). As you can see the write speeds say 4x-8x for one and just 4x for the other. When the 4x-8x option is available I notice the drive light flashes a few times while it reads the disc and then seems to spool up to speed. When just the 4x option is available the drive doesn’t seem to speed up at all at the end of it’s flashing hmmm… :a

Similar results with the Sony DVD-R 16X.

Other discs I just can’t get that 4x-8x option. So it could be the laser being dirty. I tried taking it apart but didn’t risk opening it right up. taped a straw to a vaccuum cleaner and tried sucking the dust (if any) out. Haven’t tried a drive cleaner yet.

The drive has no problems with Sony DVD+RW and Verbatim CD-R and CD-RW.

Since it’s an intel board, i don’t think it’s an NF ide controller, and it looks like you’re using the standard MS IDE drivers which is good…

The talking about spooling up - i think the drive might have trouble identifying the discs or strategies when u put them in … flashing it with another firmware might be a shot, or maybe it’s just got some quirk with your IDE controller/channel.

Try swapping the drive with someone else’s computer and see whether this happens, because otherwise it might be related to your IDE/Motherboard or DMA setting - try disabling and re-enabling. Alternatively … can you post some read benchmarks/ Burst Rate benchmark from CD-Speed just to make sure your IDE channel is fast enough to handle the drive [as I do know LG’s have a tendency to drop to a lower speed during a burn if the data doesn’t come in fast enough].

I just noticed that your system is a dell system - was this drive shipped with the dell? dell systems are known to have mass issues with some other sorts of hardware. Other people have also noted that power supplies with excessive ripple can cause the LG to malfunction or produce poor burns/drop speed. If you’re electronically minded, you might wanna add a couple of electrolytic caps to both 12v and 5v rails and see whether it improves anything. I saw a post somewhere in the LG Burner Forum … just can’t remember where …

Is there anything else connected to the same channel? If so, try removing it.

With burners now <$50 for a decent one, if this one has done considerable burning and you feel like upgrading - now might just be a good time to get one to see what’s at fault. (but upgrading a dell might be a problem as somethings are not compatible)

And as a side note NEVER LET NORMAL VACUUM CLEANERS NEAR YOUR COMPUTER! they use a belt drive system and plastic hoses tend to generate a large amount of static. This can cause the death of electronic components, so be warned!

Yes my Dell was shipped with this drive. I’ll post the benchmark readings tonight. I’ll try the firmware but not yet, I really don’t like messing around with the software settings when some people have reported problems with it or no help at all so I’ll leave that for now.

Electronically minded? Yes, but not too keen on soldering on a new computer system. Old - maybe but for now I’ll leave that alone.

Will Nero System info let me see if anything is connected to the same channel? Since I got the system the only things I’ve installed myself are an internal modem and a firewire card, but I’m pretty sure they’ve been set up correctly.

New drive? I’m considering the Pioneer 16X16 PI DVRW710R as a second drive in my system, but I’ll use that as a last resort.

So far the problem still exists, last night I’m still getting sporadic write speed options for my drive.

When you say disable and re-enable, do you mean disable the DVD drive in the control panel - system - hardware - device manager? Then do I restart my computer and go the same route to re-enable?

No No, as in check the properties page of your IDE Controller under the Device Manager … disable DMA for your secondary channel drive [the optical - not the hard disk - make sure] then restart … then re-enable DMA

Some controllers seem to fix themselves under my experience by doing that … but not many others would suggest the same.

Yes, nero infotool can show you what’s connected to each channel. But if you don’t have other drives and you’re sure that your optical drive isn’t sharing the same connection with your hard disk then that’s all fine :).

[Sorry, I’m in Australia, time zone might be a bit different so it might take a bit, however I think a new drive is what you need by the looks of it.]

Thanks, yes okay I’ll try that tonight.

I just tried the Fujifilm DVD+R at work and they seem to offer the option to write at 8X 4X and 2.4X on a DELL with a philips DVD writer using SONIC. However, I accidentally, test copied data to the disc to see if it would work at 8x which it did (in doing so the disc is no longer usable to store data and that was my only 8x fujifilm that worked at 8x at home, oh well) so it seems like the media is okay.
I have SONIC at home and I haven’t checked to see if speed options are available there. I’ll check them tonight.

But sadly, yes, it looks like it’s turning out to be the drive. I’ll let you know about the IDE controller situation tonight, and I’m pretty sure the Hard disk isn’t sharing the same connection.

Not too adept at using Nero CD/DVD speed. Just started using it.

The drive has the DMA enabled and I’ve tried disabling the DVD drive and re-enabling it. Didn’t help anything.

The SONIC burning program does not offer me the 8x 4x 2.4x that it does at work, the only option available is 4x :confused: so my drive is having trouble recognizing the disc.

I also noticed a ton of drivers using the info tool in NERO. Maybe one is confilicting but everything shows it’s working okay.

Sonic isn’t that great of a burn engine. You could try IMGBurn to see if that makes a difference, [B]but[/B] I think it is more your drive that is starting to fail and not working properly with that particular PC configuration and power.
Try another DVD-RW drive on that system and maybe save the LG DVD-RW for a more powerful PC which may still help that drive function properly even though it’s on its final count.

I agree too, but IMGBurn will show a list of speeds that you can’t use in the drop down box. What you have to look for is the Supported Speeds in the text box - that will tell you what the drive returns. Looks like your frive is probably the culprit, seeing that your DVD-Identifier says so - however if you do have cd-emulation engines that have “hide cd-r media” or “hide ATIP” - try disabling it because i’ve seen that interfere with burns before or correct recognition of blank media.

Also, do you perhaps have any copy protected discs using protection systems like StarForce that might just cause additional problems?

[Just trying to think of possibilities which are at the extreme end … though I don’t think i’ll have much to suggest other than swap or get a new one and see whether it makes a difference. Just trying the last ditch things to see whether we can get your burner burning again, however, seeing that it’s a LG Bulk model, I find that most bulk drives are slightly worse in calibration and or quality and they might have balky lasers - i know my bulk BenQ 1640’s did … and so did my bulk QSI SBW-242B slimline laptop drive - so I’m sure that one you buy would probably be better. :)]

How do i find out about the cd-emulation engine and check to see if hide cd-r or hide atip is enabled?

Starforce? I’m pretty sure I don’t. How do I find out if it’s installed on my computer? The last game I bought was back in 1997. So unless they’re installed using a DVD movie in my drive then I probably don’t have to worry.

As an update, I burned an ISO image file last night on the Fujifilm 8x which accepted an 8x burn, it burned okay but the burn on the disc didn’t look that good. Although it played in my standalone dvd player a message did come up as I was playing (Disc is dirty) even though it was clean. So it could mean my computer burner laser is dirty, needs cleaning or is about to go by the way side. Wouldn’t hurt to get one of those disc laser cleaner discs I guess.

My computer is powerful enough: 3 GHz. CPU 800 MHz Bus speed 1GB of memory. I would use Nero info tool to show all of my drivers and info but you can’t copy and paste the info - can only print to paper.

I’ll try a 16x sony burn image file and see if that works okay.

Okay converted a few mpeg files to iso and copied them to dvd using nero. I did get the option to write at 8x so I did. The rings are somewhat still there, a little faint but now they’re also appearing near the edge of the dvd as well as the beginning. So I threw in a Sony DVD 16x which read 4x arrrgghhhhh! Removed and put in another disc and got my 16x write option. Did the 16x burn and it was good, no visible defects in the disc.

So the burns still work, it just seems to be the drive isn’t reading the discs properly. As was pointed out the drive is probably on the way out. Could still just be a dirty laser, have yet to find out.

Okay I’ve loaded the latest firmware E113 from DELL for my DVD writer
HL-DT-ST DVD±RW GWA4164B upgraded from the last version D108.

No difference at all !

My DVD writer still doesn’t allow 16x write speed option on the DVD-R 16x Sony discs made in Japan. It does sporadically but as the days computer ages it seems to become less and less.