Burned DVD Successful, Verification bad?

Hi I just got a NEC ND-3550A and burned like 10 DVDs of data files using Nero. Everytime it says that the burn was successful. Then it occurs to me to turn on data verification and that’s when the problems start. I used some rar files that I could check the checksums of to make verify that the files were bad. I checked the originals and then the ones of the DVDs and they were bad just like it came up on Nero.

I’m using Ridata 16X DVD+R burning at 16X. I’ve tried a few things like moving the files to a hard drive on a different IDE channel, then burning. Turned off all kinds of background processes. Burning at 4X. Nothing worked. I even burned a CDR, which for some reason only had a top speed of 16X, and it actually came out okay with data verification.

How can I tell if its my drive or my media that’s bad?

  1. Update your burner’s firmware, I would suggest updating to Liggy and Dee’s latest modified firmware. Look in the NEC forum here under the burners forums.

  2. Try burning at 12x, alot of 16x media burns better at 12x. Burning at 4x is usually too slow for 16x media and quality will suffer, if you encounter problems at 16x, try 12x and 8x.

  3. Download Nero CD-DVD Speed (it’s free) and use its tests for testing your burns, the ‘verify’ function is often inaccurate. Run a ‘disc quality’ test on a disc that you’ve burned and post an image of the scan when it’s done. Test at 5x for accurate comparisons when testing with a NEC burner. You may also want to run a Transfer Rate test to check overall readability of the disc and post those results as well.

  4. Ridata/Ritek media is not very good media in most cases at this point, they used to make well regarded media a couple of years ago but people have had lots of problems with them for awhile now. Even so, you should be able to get at least useable results with those discs on a NEC.

Thanks sooo much!

I tend to agree about it most liklly being the media. ritek (thats what ridata is) has been producing some terible media recentlly. Follow scoobies recomendations about scaning the disk to verify it though. Try getting some verbatim 16x disks (verbatium 8x are good too if you get mcc which most is for now anyway, but verbatim has quit producing 8x media and buys from other manufactures so you run a small risk of getting that same crappy ritek disks from 8x verbatium). Made in japan maxell, sony or fuji are good too (make sure they are made in japan, not all are).

Well, here I haven’t yet used an alternate firmware yet but I wrote at 12X and used Nero CD-DVD to check the disk quality.

I’ve seen a few of these on the forum but still don’t exactly understand what it all means. Anyhow, I guess I won’t just RMA it yet till I get my hands on some better media and changing the firmware. Thanks.

PS: I read the FAQ that comes with the custom firmware, they say that I can’t RMA after upgrading with this firmware but couldn’t I just return it to the original firmware and then return it if that didn’t fix it?

That is an absolutly terrible burn!!! I would say that it is very liklly the media and not the drive. Its kind of hard to read the graph because that one horrible, tremendiously high spike changed the scale of the graph, but you have areas in the first graph that go up to 500 over an area. To me a top quality burn stays under 20, not 500. While I usally don’t look at the number of errors too much as the graph tells more, since the graph is kind of hard to read (though obviouslly terible), I recently scanned an mcc disk (same as verbatium) that was burned about 7 months before (and had some scratches), and the pi total was about 40,000, compared to almost 2 million on yours, and pi count was around 350 total, compared to over 5000 on yours.
Despite the low quality of ritek, your drive really, really, reeeaaally doesn’t like this media. Defanatlly try beter media.

Other than that one spike, the burn would be useable, it’s basically a coaster with that one spike though. You need to test your discs at 5x, not 8x, on NEC drives for most accurate results/comparisons as I said before (there are times when I drive can give much different test results at different speeds and NECs have a generally accepted ‘rule’ of testing at 5x for most useful test results). Also, NEC drives aren’t the best testing drives, although they are perfectly serviceable and will at least give you a fairly good idead of burn quality. The data is probably fully readable on that disc, but I would not trust it with anything remotely important because of that one high spike of errors. A spike like that is often caused by a blemish, such as a speck of grime or a scratch on that spot of the disc, you might want to take a close look at the bottom of the disc on the outer third and see if you can find anything unusual. I can also see that even without the one spike, the PI levels are very high. While PI levels are not much of a concern as PIF levels are what are of importance when it comes to readability, elevated PI levels are still a sign of a lower quality burn/media. If not for the one spike, it looks like the disc’s PIF levels would be decent.

You may also want to run a transfer rate test on the disc - if it finishes with a smooth read curve or only minor spikes, that means that the disc is fully readable, even at high speeds. If the test ends prematurely (such as at that spike) or has severe speed dips below, say, 2x, that means that the drive is having problems reading the data at that spot on the disc. If the test finishes despite severe dips, the data is fully readable but the burn is very shaky in quality. If the test doesn’t even finish, you will likely have problems getting all of the data read off of the disc, even at low read speeds.

To your question about firmware and warranty, yes you can simply flash back to the original firmware. Only in very rare occasions do drives encounter problems where there is some unrecoverable flashing error, especially with NEC burners - they are quite reliable.

ripit is correct in suggesting that you ultimately should get better media as I pointed out they are not the greatest discs, but you already have them so you should try to make the most of them so that you can at least get useable burn quality if only for unimportant burns (giveaways to friends, temporary data transfer, etc.). The best thing you can do in order to potentially improve your burns is to update the firmware and test your results at 12x and 8x, as I mentioned earlier.

Good Luck and let us know how it goes.

Hey 3550A,

I would also suggest shutting off all of your unnecessary programs, to include online and virus protect during your burn process. I had better success with theses programs disabled. Also, do a test run with the same movie or data on every available burn speed then check each one. It may waste some discs but you will know what speed is best for that media, and you can give someone a gift if the burns are usable. :slight_smile:

think 8x w/r04’s with nec 3550

better media than ridata

Hopefully that last burn was a fluke, so I burned the same files at 8X with the same media and tested at 5X and took the advice of quitting any internet related processes, although Norton only allows a timed deactivation of autoprotect. I have yet to use the new firmware though.

here’s some good media burned at 8x on my nec 3550

Wow, that’s very different from mine. A few questions though: first, what kind of media is that? (verbatim?) So you burned this on a NEC checked the disk on a BenQ?

Also, is there a reason why jitter doesn’t show up on my test, or is that what that red spike in my test is?

Sorry, I have so many questions :slight_smile:

That is Verbatim if not, verbatim makes the same media MCC 004 (it is rated at 16X). What type of burner you have vs type of media makes a world of difference. I would suggest that Benq with the MCC 004 or taiyo yuden media t03. You can also get Liteon 1693s with Taiyo Yuden +R YUDEN000 02 media, this is supposed to be a great combo. Just remeber you can get a 50 stack of good taiyo yuden media and the burner for under $100 if you shop smart. :slight_smile:

Look at the numeric scale on the left. That is what tells you how hight the errors are. Notice how yours in the second one goes up over 400 in the first graph? Notice how rbrtpl’s only goes up to 8? yours it crap, his is very good. Same for pif, his is much lower. While it doesn’t nesasarilly make a burn unreadable (you can have kind of a lot of errors across the whole disk but if they do not spike up too high in one spot, the disk still may be readable), look at the number of errors at the bottom. pi 2,197,997 pif 5842 on your second one. On rbrtpl’s, pi 14,884, pif 55.

The book standard allows for 280 max pi and 32 max pif. Due to variations in equipment, mass production, the fact that these drives are not professional scanning equipment and the push to competitivly get equipment out cheap with burners, dvd players, disks, whatever, a disk that is a little under those limits may have some playability problems or may play just fine. It is perfectly reasonable to expect burns substantially under those limits, but yours is obviouslly over them. rbrtpl’s scan is very good by the way. If it had gone up to 40 pi, it would still be just fine, but why not shoot for the best (the nec’s are good drives so you can shoot for the best). Personally, I require under 20 pi, under 3 pif (on k probe which has a lower pif scale) on my own burns to consider them good and continue to use that media, but you can easilly go over that and still be fine.

One more point. Stop thinking in terms of brands when it comes to disks. Download dvd identifier and start thinking in terms of media codes. The disks rbrtpl is using are are mcc004. It just so happens that verbatim 16x+r are just about guarenteed to be mcc004, but with most brands, thats not the way it works. They may be several media codes from the same brand, format and speed. Even though mcc is manufatured by mitsubishi (the parent company of verbatium), there are other brands where you can find mcc media too as they sell to other companies.

mcc004 would be an exelent choice of media to try, but I don’t think anyone has any on sale this week (might want to try micro center if there is one near you or see what is on sale online, check the bargain basment). Being on sale makes a drastic diffrence in price at the retail stores (many stores sell 50 packs of verbatium for 40$ but sale price is under 15$). check this thread
Circuit city has nexxtech on sale for about 7$ per 25 and if you know how to identify them (see the thread), you can get mcc02rg20 (same as verbatium 8x-r) though some are reporting getting mcc03rg20 (same as verbatium 16x-r) even though the package says 8x.
Does anyone know how the nec 3550 does with -r media? My nec 3500 does just fine with the ones circuit city has. there is a scan posted in that thread of the 8x stuff on a disk that was burned 7 months ago and scanded just the other day. I have no idea about the spike at the begining because they do not burn like that for me but it was the only disk handy to scan (maybe it is because the disk is scratched up)but still the spike only goes up to 40 pi (not 400).

Fyi, rbrtpl, sorry to talk about your post instead of letting you talk about your own scan, hope I didn’t offend.

Here is another thread about some mcc media on sale (if it still is)
Even though the burns scanned on that thread were doen with a benq, I think that you will find that mcc media usally burns very good.


You did a better job than I would have and that’s a verb from office max or best buy
which costs 30Cents. mid 90’s on the tyG02/3’s from supermedia @ 8x, I won’t post any 12x scans to show why I burn at 8x with the immature firmware. Too many spikes at end.

here’s a TYG02 burned at 8x with 3550A dee’s latest,
this burner likes +r more, my nec 3540 does better with these TY mids.

I have never burned a DVD less than 92 quality! Something is seriously wrong here!

I just got around to flashing my NEC with Liggy’s firmware for 3550A. Each burn I burned the same files as with my other tests but here I’ve changed the firmware. The first one was burned at 12X and the second at 8X. I’ve noticed that my buffer levels would shoot down to 7% then go up to 97% and would do that every so often although the read buffer stayed at 100%. If that’s the problem, is it the drive or my computer?

It’s not that strange for the buffer to jump around, especially if the drive is having a problem burning the disk. I still say it is very liklly the disks and both those scans are pretty bad.