Anyone use Dvd-RAM for daily recording?

[leaglebob]

I currently have an Ilo-5, Liteon 5005, and Liteon 5045. In my opinion, NONE of them reliably burn rewriteable disks. ((They all do ok with write once.))

From what I've read, dvd-ram is touted, without real specifics, as having error checking routines that make it "near perfect" for constant use? If thats true, I'd like to get a dvd-ram capable standalone to use as my vcr replacement. Record and watch shows and delete those that aren't worth recording and when the disk is full transfer those files to my computer.

Does anyone out there do this on a regular basis--ie, is dvd-ram format reliable enough for such heavy duty use? ///// thanks, bobbo.

PS and by the way- - - does anyone do this with dvd =/- rw? If so, what machine and media do you have such wondferful luck with?????

[fino]

I have used ram discs every day for 7 months in my Panasonic DMR-ES20 with no problems. What I like is you can edit the commercials out and get the space back to use.

[leaglebob]

So it actually works???? Thats good to know. What brand of blank media do you use? /// bobbo

[had1]

legalbob,
I've been messing around with 3 and soon to be 4 RMA'd 5005's. I borrowed my brother's Panny ES10 and it puts you at a whole new level!! I would skip the ES20 and get the ES15 which is actually an upgraded new 2006 model to the ES20 which is very buggy or the ES25 which offers HDTV up-conversion! I have used RAM disc in the ES10 and they are great for editing out what you don't want + you can start recording and while recording start watching from the beginning! I purchased Panasonic brand @ walmart. y walmart also sells Maxell but I haven't tried them yet!
had1

[fino]

I use panasonic discs. I don't think the DMR ES20 is still made looks like it's been replaced by the 25 which supports SD cards. I was going to do what you plan to I bought 2 NEC 3550 drives I thought supported ram but they don't :doh:

[leaglebob]

Thanks guys. Yes==both of my Liteons had to be repaired within warranty period but have worked pretty well thereafter except for about zero compatibility with re writeable disks. I exchanged the ILO 4 times at Walmart before getting one that has worked pretty well.

Now I'm fussing around trying to confirm which standalone and which computer based dvd-ram units will or won't use a cassette. Websites often don't give that info and so far tech help wont answer emails. One source seemed to imply that that the cassette will fit "universally" into any tray but I don't want to pay return shipping to find out for sure. -could this be true???-

It makes sense to me to go ahead and use a cassette arrangement. This "hobby" would be very frustrating if I weren't heavily medicated??????
bobbo.

[CDan]

Now I'm fussing around trying to confirm which standalone and which computer based dvd-ram units will or won't use a cassette.

No PC drives will accept cartridges. All the Panasonic recorders will accept cartridges. If you will be taking the discs back and forth from recorder to PC, it's probably safer not to use cartridges, as removing the disc from it's cartridge presents risks for damage to the disc. (it's a little clumsy).

[leaglebob]

Thanks CDan. I have seen 1-2 pc based burners that advertise they handle cassettes/cartridges but they do cost 120-150 bucks, so I've been keeping my eyes open for cheaper models==such as a ROM/reader only and not a burner.

From your post, I am now convinced that if it doesn't advertise the cassette ability, then it ain't there. Thanks much. //// bobbo.

[joeroyhud]

I use a Panasonic DMR-ES15 with RAM discs. No problems. On my PC is a Pioneer DVR-111D to read the discs for further editing, splicing, dicing, etc.
I'm happy with the way it all works. It's a low-end system -- $150 or so for the recorder and $40 or so for the drive.

Be aware that the RAM recordings are written in a different format, DVD-VR. If you're used to using DVD Shrink or Nero Recode on your PC, those won't work with DVD-RAM.

[leaglebob]

Joeroyhud- - -a happy dvd user??? I ENVY you and hope I gain the same satisfaction when I buy my next system that surely will be dvd-ram based. I thought the format might be a problem but there would be solutions? I use mpg-vcr to edit the vob/tau/mpg files and other than lacking a time-synch ability, it is a wonderful program.

What do you use to edit those commercials out, And what ram media have you been using??? //// bobbo.

[joeroyhud]

leaglebob --

I do most of the trimming on the recorder itself. On the Panny, you turn a commercial into a chapter, and then you delete the chapter. Trimming on the recorder is more precise than on the PC software I've been using.

On the PC, I've been using mostly TMPGEnc DVD Author. Nero Vision Express also seems to work. Both will convert the contents of a RAM disc to regular DVD-Video format for DVD±R discs.

For RAM discs, I've tried only Panasonic 2-3x non-cartridge discs so far. That's been the most painful part -- 3x is sloooooow!

[leaglebob]

Excellent, I have both of those programs already. My liteon hard drive recorder allows editing in the same manner--creating chapters and deleting them then joining the remainder==all with push button "step" commands. I find the edit points to vary quite a bit not being very accurate at all. Very tedious and can take an hour to edit an hour show.

On the other hand, using mpg-vcr, I can get single frame edits (ie EXACT accuracy) and edit an hour show in one minute.

I plan on using the ram disks to record tv and edit on the computer. That recording is done in real time (ie==one "x") and it sounds like you are doing the same?? or--what are you doing that takes time where x3 is a limitation? //// Thanks again for your information above. bobbo!

[joeroyhud]

It just takes a long time to copy to the hard drive

[agomes]

If you come back here, just an indication: there are PC drives that support cartridge DVD-RAM discs.

Besides those drives are not easy to find and quite expensive compared to "normal" SuperMulti drives that use bare discs.

Panasonic SW-9574-C does it, but they have also non-cartridge drives like the SW-9585-C.
You can have a look here : http://www.panasonic-industrial.com/1185.htm

[leaglebob]

Agomes==thanks. Yes, this thread notifies me fairly quickly. I added those drives to my bookmarks. I also understand that joining the "Panasonic Club" allows the purchase of Panasonic dvd-rams at a good discount.

I was shopping at Best Buy and looking at the dvd-ram open stock shelves. Units can be had for $90. The alternative that springs immediately to mind though is to simply use write once disks for importing into my computer. That would provide me with reliable media/burning and an instant backup. Can buy alot of write once disks for the cost of using dvd-ram??? (ie==can't get either one of my Liteons to record to either plus or minus rewriteables with "any" reliability at all==it kills me to load up my computer with half a movie or 3 of four part series all because the media fails===but that is my experience!!). thanks for your info. ///bobbo.

[Jedilord]

I have a Panasonic DMR-100HE. It's a great recorder, it works flawlessly with any kind of DVD Ram (cartridge or not) and the discs work just fine in my LG 4120B and LG 4165B Pc burners. What I do when I want to transport something from the Panny hard drive to my PC for editing is to transfer the titles I want to a DVD Ram and then I just copi the large file with VRO extenison. When the process is complete (& or 7 minutes with a full disc) I just rename the VRO file to "whaterver*.MPG" and voila! It works as a Mpeg 2 file. The only thing is that when I use Vegas for editing, I have no audio track. :a Maybe because its an AC3 track and not PCM audio. Not sure about that. The workaround is to extract the audio and convert it to Mp2 audio and multiplex it again with TMPGenc or something like that. Just let me tell you the Panasonic is the best machine in the market, far from Philips, Sony and all the others. Well, maybe LG is good enough to be compared with the Panny.

[Rombaldi]

No PC drives will accept cartridges. All the Panasonic recorders will accept cartridges. If you will be taking the discs back and forth from recorder to PC, it's probably safer not to use cartridges, as removing the disc from it's cartridge presents risks for damage to the disc. (it's a little clumsy).

Not true. Not at all true.

First. There are SEVERAL PC drives that will take carts... LF-D321, LF-D521, LF-M821 and SW-9574 to name 4. All Panasonic drives. The SW-9574 is 16x DVD-R/+R and does DL also. I have 4 machine and they ALL have cart capable drives (and a coupla of 9574's on the shelf for spares, picked them up on eBay for < $40 each, new).

Second. Carts are the BEST AND SAFEST WAT TO HANDLE RAM. DVD-Ram has been around lot longer than the Panasonic DVD Recorders. Keeps finger prints off. Drop them and they're still safe. Safe to leave on the desk and safe from your 5-yeard old nephew and his peanut-butter and jelly fingers :bigsmile:

[leaglebob]

Great!! This thread is picking up with need to know real life experience.

JediLord--does the panny record vro files when burning to -dvd or does this happen only when using ram disks??

I know folks do it but having to demux, remux adds a layer of complexity I really want to avoid. Anyone have a program that copies/coverts the ram recorded material directly to a format that mpeg editors/dvd author programs can use?

Thanks for the great info!!!! /// bobbo.

[leaglebob]

Romboldi--great info there and the best price I have ever seen on a pc based cartridge drive. I just checked ebay and no such deals there now==but I'll check in there and elsewhere. Dvd-ram has had nothing but positive reviews so my next standalone has to be one of them with the pc upgrade to support it. Any suggestions about editing software to cut out the commercials and record to +/- dvds? I'm quite happy with straight mpeg data files. The liteon treats these just as if they were dvd compliant so I don't see the need for any extra authoring. Thanks//// bobbo.

[Rombaldi]

I know folks do it but having to demux, remux adds a layer of complexity I really want to avoid. Anyone have a program that copies/coverts the ram recorded material directly to a format that mpeg editors/dvd author programs can use?.

You need a copy of DVD Moviel Album SE & the DVD Movie Album Tools disc that comes packed with (retail) Panasonic drives (or look about, they're out there). They will let you extract individual programs from the RAM discs as VRO files. Womble Mpeg Video Wizard and Tmpgenc DVD Author 2.0 will accept the VRO files. They will also both import individual programs from the disc.

DO NOT use Movie Album to 'extract' MPG files. For reasons unknown to mortal man, they will convert the AC3 2.0 audio to MPEG audio. The Movie Album Copy tool will leave it as AC3 (again Womble and Tmpgenc will accept/edit these without complaint and leave it as AC3.

ONLY AT YOUR OWN RISK should you simply 'drag' the VRO file from the disc to to your HD and use it. It's a little long to explain here (but I will if necessary) but given the way DVD-RAM works, it is POSSIBLE to have NON-CONTINIOUS VIDEO in the VRO file...

short version.

• start with a BLANK, FRESHLY FORMATTED disc.
• record 60 minutes on the disc
• remove 20 commercials using the DVD-Recorder functions
• record 30 more minutes.
• drag it to your HD directly.

You'll find the last 30 minutes UNTERLEAVED in the 1st recorded program.

It's the way RAM works and it's what let's you 'reclaim' the edited space back to be recorded on.

Oh... sneaky tip #2

• format a RAM in the Panasonic recorder, you have 2:00 recording time
• record a short program (a minute or so)
• take the disc to a PC drive and load it up
• use the DVD-Movie Album program and DELETE the program you just recorded (MUST BE DONE ON THE PC WITH DVD-MA for this trick to work).
• take the disc back to the Panasonic recorder.
• you now have 2:07 recording time and will KEEP this even after deleting/recording on the Panny. It will keep the 2:07 until you reformat the disc.

I don't know why, but it just works.