AC3/DTS audiocopy .AVIs incompatible with Vista - No sound!

WinTakeAll 2008-02-18 01:54:53 UTC #1

It seems as if DVDFab in audiocopy mode generates broken .AVI file containers that are incompatible with Vista's built-in .AVI DirectShow source filter with regard to audio.

Under Vista, DirectShow players (e.g. WMP, Media Center) don't give you any sound when you play DVDFab-generated "audiocopy" .AVI files with an AC3 or DTS soundtrack, although you have installed good DirectShow filters that can handle these audio formats (e.g. AC3Filter, Spdifer or ffdshow). This is applies to the 'generic.avi.h264.audiocopy' and 'generic.avi.xvid.audiocopy' profiles.

The reasons for me to blame DVDFab's AVI file container specifially are:

DS players under XP Plays these .AVIs with both audio and video as long as you have the required DS filters. But presumably Microsoft's .AVI source filter changed between XP and Vista.

Vista still gives you sound on AC3/DTS .AVIs generated with tools other than DVDFab using any DirectShow player as long as you have AC3/DTS DS filters installed. So it's not that Vista with DS can't play AC3/DTS AVIs; it's just DVDFab's AC3/DTS AVIs that are a problem - there's something special about DVDFab's version of the .AVI file container and Vista.

Media Player Classic under Vista plays these .AVIs fine as long as you leave its default setting of using its internal .AVI source filter (under Options->Internal Filters). But the moment you disable that and fallback to Vista's default .AVI source filter, MPC fails to give audio. (On that Options page you can also choose MPC's internal AC3/DTS filter or generic DS filters, and either works as long as you use MPC's .AVI source filter.)

VLC plays these .AVIs since it doesn't depend on DirectShow filters.

Note: This problem may be the same as the problems in this and this thread.

GregiBoy 2008-02-18 02:34:04 UTC #2

How about this?

Vista is up to the normal standards of Micri$oft software and needs a lot of work !!!

Please install a codec that ACTUALLY works such as FFDShow.

WOULD NOT THE FACT THAT VLC WORKS SUGGEST TO YOU THAT THERE IS SOMETHING WRONG WITH VISTA & DIRECTSHOW ?

WinTakeAll 2008-02-18 14:56:16 UTC #3

Vista is up to the normal standards of Micri$oft software and needs a lot of work !!!

Fine. You can hate MS, Windows Vista, death, and taxes, but for the rest of us these are things we have to find a way to live with.

Please install a codec that ACTUALLY works such as FFDShow

As I mention above I’ve tried ffdshow and other codecs, and found that it’s not a codec issue.

WOULD NOT THE FACT THAT VLC WORKS SUGGEST TO YOU THAT THERE IS SOMETHING WRONG WITH VISTA & DIRECTSHOW ?

I see two possibilities:

[ol]
[li]DVDFab is at fault: Its AC3/DTS audiocopy .AVIs are not up to spec, but VLC and MPC’s AVI source filters are forgiving enough to still handle them. What to do? Fix DVDFab so that it generates files that also Vista’s DirectShow AVI source filter can handle!
[/li]
[li]Vista is at fault: DVDFab’s .AVIs are valid but that there’s something wrong with Vista’s DirectShow AVI source filter. But note that tools other than DVDFab generate AC3/DTS .AVIs that do work with Vista, maybe using different AVI options. In this case, it’d be hard to get MS to update Vista to also allow DVDFab’s flavor of AVIs even if they’re technically OK. What’s the reasonable thing to do? Fix DVDFab so that it generates files that also Vista’s DirectShow AVI source filter can handle!
[/li][/ol]

WinTakeAll 2008-02-18 19:28:50 UTC #4

Using the video file analyzer GSpot I’m noticing that DVDFab seems unique among current video encoders in that its output is NOT ‘DivX Style “packed bitstream” AVI’.

So one possibility is that Vista requires packed bitstream in the video stream (which reduces latency) to be able to process an AC3/DTS audio stream and send it to the installed DS filter.

And then if we can only have DVDFab do packed bitstream it can produce Vista-compatible AC3/DTS AVis like the competition have been for a long time (even files encoded long before Vista).

It’s been said though that there are some old non-DivX compliant standalone players that do not work with packed bitstream, so maybe the very best would be to make this an option.

WinTakeAll 2008-02-19 23:48:15 UTC #5

[QUOTE=WinTakeAll;2003117]one possibility is that Vista requires packed bitstream in the video stream (which reduces latency) to be able to process an AC3/DTS audio stream and send it to the installed DS filter[/QUOTE]

On second though I no longer believe the above. Seems far-fetched that the internals of the video stream should affect the audio stream. And as orignially mentioned, the problem with no sound remains the same with H264 also, and I don’t think the packbits option applies to H264.

I’ve compared other GSpot-reported details between DVDFab’s broken AC3 sound files and files with working AC3 sound from other tools, and I can’t really see a pattern. For example, both files with AVI version 1 and 2 work as long as they didn’t come from DVDFab. And both “Audio Frames: Split across interleave” and “Aligned on interleaves” work, again as long as the file didn’t come from DVDFab.

But there’s still has to be something unusual about DVDFab’s AC3/DTS AVIs that Vista’s AVI demuxer doesn’t like, causing lack of audio…

fdt 2008-02-26 16:44:42 UTC #6

Great explanation, WinTakeAll… I just hope someone will hear you… and fix this bug.

WinTakeAll 2008-02-29 03:05:26 UTC #7

More findings:

I can fix these AVI files using the tool AVI-Mux GUI. That’s a freeware tool that comes with source code, so I it may be helpful in fixing DVDfab.
Another rather wonderful video tool Avidemux, shares this problem with DVDfab. Maybe it uses the same AVI generation library? Anyway, also files from Avidemux can be fixed with AVI-Mux.

cbaram 2008-03-03 18:30:25 UTC #8

just chiming in to indicate that I am having the same problem and would love to see it fixed. I have several machines one of which has Vista that I cannot use to watch movies that were backed up using the DVD to Mobile Generic settings of xvid + source audio. Audio source being AC3 or DTS yet my XP machines or an alternate player on my Vista machine work fine.

I hope a fix comes soon. I have not tried fixing the files using AVI-Mux Gui

changer6 2008-04-25 03:00:38 UTC #9

Thanks, WinTakeAll. I share your pain.

When bringing-up .avi’s created with DVDfab using graphedt.exe, no connection gets created between AVI Splitter (quartz.dll) and ffdShow Audio Decoder. This leads me to believe that the vista implementation of quartz.dll is to blame. Googling vista quartz.dll reveals a whole slurry of complaints. Some people have rolled-back to older versions of quartz.dll with success. Any thoughts??

cholla 2008-04-25 10:17:58 UTC #10

cybmole gave me this registry & WMC tweak for Vista.Now my Vista WMC will play a movie from the movies folder I have in a DVD folder that was added as a location in “ADD Movies” in WMC.
I ripped a commercial DVD with DVDFab HD Decrypter the free version .I put the ripped folder strait into this DVD folder & WMC played it with no problem.

You can 'Open" in WMP11 by selecting all the files in the VIDEO_TS folder.Sound plays fine.

cybmole 2008-04-25 10:25:46 UTC #11

[QUOTE=cholla;2044932]cybmole gave me this registry & WMC tweak for Vista.Now my Vista WMC will play a movie from the movies folder I have in a DVD folder that was added as a location in “ADD Movies” in WMC.
I ripped a commercial DVD with DVDFab HD Decrypter the free version .I put the ripped folder strait into this DVD folder & WMC played it with no problem.

You can 'Open" in WMP11 by selecting all the files in the VIDEO_TS folder.Sound plays fine.[/QUOTE]

yes, I can get dixv +ac3 aaudio passthru output files to play in vista WMP but still not in the media center interface. And vista WMP pauses to “acquire codec” every time one of these file is opened. I’ve deinstalled, reinstalled & tweaked ffdshow & ac3 filter far too many times already & have now given up with this particular format in favour of xvid+mp3 which is more forgiving.
I have an XP media center edition PC & the files play OK in that media center interface, so I reckon it’s a vista home premium edition problem.

But as I said a while back, I do think that fab’s authors should test their output formats in Vista & in Vista Media Center & do all they can to make them fully compliant.

cholla 2008-04-25 10:36:39 UTC #12

cybmole ;The ones I’m playing are just a DVD files rip with DVDFab HD Decrypter the free version .With the tweak these play fine.These show the ac3 as the Audio codec but MPEG2 as the video codec.
I have Vista HPE .

cybmole 2008-04-25 11:10:25 UTC #13

yes , the problem is not with DVD files made using the DVD to DVd options, it is with files made using DVD to mobile options (specifically, using generic xvid+ac3 option)

I use these options when I want to make an avi file for use in the video library e.g. to take 1 song from a music dvd. The video library lets you have subdirectories, whereas vista media center shows all DVDs as one big cluttered collection, so there are times when I’d prefer to use generic option rather than customise or main movie options.

cholla 2008-04-25 11:23:32 UTC #14

The free version doesn’t have the mobile options.Full disc & Main movie are the only options.So theres no way for me to make a .avi file like generic xvid+ac3 option to test with.

marcusblagrove 2008-06-04 02:57:15 UTC #15

I was having the same problem decribed here; i was going mad trying to fix it!

AVI-Mux GUI fixed the problem perfectley - thanks WinTakeAll.

duckrising 2008-06-04 10:51:50 UTC #16

I also had this problem and installing the ffdshow codecs didn’t work at all. Strangly what did work was removing the ffdshow codecs and installing the K-Lite Codec pack, this installed the ffdshow codecs as part of the install and it worked! The videos have sound, it says it’s being played via the ffdshow codecs, but I’ve no idea why or what K-Lite did that I didn’t.

WinTakeAll 2008-07-03 16:06:09 UTC #17

[QUOTE=duckrising;2070986]…installing the K-Lite Codec pack, this installed the ffdshow codecs as part of the install and it worked! The videos have sound, it says it’s being played via the ffdshow codecs, but I’ve no idea why or what K-Lite did that I didn’t.[/QUOTE]

Most likely K-Lite installed an AVI source filter which overrides Vista’s built in one, and happens to support this flavor of AVI files with AC3 sound.

But most people in the know strongly recommends against codec packs such as K-Lite exactly because they make so many undisclosed system affecting modifications like these. K-Lite’s new source filter appearantly supports these AVI files, but more than likely it breaks others.

The source filter is the piece of code that processes the file before it gets sent to a codec. Its job is to understand the file container format and determine which codecs to use for the contents.

ehammock 2008-08-05 10:47:11 UTC #18

I’ve just built a shuttle media centre (with no end of problems but that’s another thread!!) I am suffering exactly this problem. I installed ffddshow then the KLite pack on my lap top and it worked but not on hte shuttle, this is clearly a very tempramental problem with no real solution as yet - Heeeeelp, misus is getting peeved with new gadget still not working;-) !!!

cobaltgrey 2008-09-09 13:02:07 UTC #19

You are the man wintake!! AVI-Mux works great!! I now have a functioning home theater!!!