ANYDVD with HD-DVDs

HD-DVDs are being released starting next month. How will we copy those? Arent they like 15GB or so? Do we have to wait for the blank HD-DVD format to come out/HD-DVD drives?

I'm waiting til blu-ray becomes MAINSTREAM before I purchase another burner...and that will be quite a wait, lol...

Currently they are selling for 2-3 grand. :-\

We won't.

Or if we will, it'll be using some new, obscure, future method.

But since even HDTV's just barely outstrip the resolution of standard DVD's, and since nobody is actually going to BUY any HD-DVD sets or discs... who cares?

There is no way I'm going to bother with HD or Blueray stuff until I have no choice! I'm not jumping on that crazy bandwagon just for the sake of it.

Absolutely and lookin at the prices for the upgrades to enjoy the new gen manipulated DVDs, it's too much for a burner like samsung's mentioned price about 500-600 usd + one disc 20-60 usd.!

It's gonna be quite a few years until the public settles on either blu-ray or hd-dvd. After that, DVD is still gonna be around a while. Hell there are still new movies released on VHS. Don't start sweating it yet.

I don't think most of us need to worry about not having a backup solution to the outrageously expensive movies that will be released in the HD formats. The whole Blu-Ray/HD-DVD thing may turn out, for both standards, about as well as Howard Hugh's huge, money-losing transport plane, the Hercules! I think there may be some other standard coming, or waiting to be born, that will prove more practical for the eventual transition to Hi-Def home entertainment.

Very few of us will quickly jump to invest in them, or the playback equiptment. Or (to protect our investment) the burners, or the media for years to come! And even if we initially want to rent rather than invest in owning, I'm sure the rental outlets are going to be very unthrilled at the thought of investing in two standards like in the days when they had to carry both Betamax and VHS on their shelves! Dual format players will resolve some of this problem. But without a "cassette" or floppy type of encasement to protect the Blu-Ray or HD-DVD DVDs, the rental outlets will have to contend with very expensive replacement costs for scratched returns or the studios will have to provide a replacement "insurance policy" to overcome rental company's endorcement objections. And when will the rental outlets actually decide to invest in inventory to rent to an initially nitch market of the population who buy the playback equiptment (new player, next generation Widescreen HD-Television and manipulative, proprietary, copy protection TV cables and connectors to next generation sound systems!). So where are the studios gonna get their initial income from Hi-Def movie releases? This is gonna be a real longterm investment/return on their part if this thing even flies!

I remember my father saying color TV was just a novelty for the rich! Prices will eventually fall slowly over time. So of course Blu-Ray, HD-DVD, or something else like them, but more practical, less expensive and less proprietary, will fly ... but when...

I think regular DVD's will be released for at least another decade. I just checked IMDb, and virtually all new DVD releases are still being released in VHS even though 7.x of 10 American households have transitioned from VHS players to DVD players or have upgraded to combo-player units.

I believe the first DVD to be released was "Twister" in March of 1997. After almost 10 years of transitioning, obviously the 30%+/- of households who still only buy VHS is a market segment of income the studios won't yet give up. And they are smart not to alienate the limited financial ability of many around the world to afford upgrading. Or their valid opinion that VHS's 240 lpi quality and 1.33:1 playback and 2-channel sound is adaquate for their home entertainment needs. This 7 out of 10 figure is probably different outside of the USA but if the transition pattern holds true for the DVD to Hi-Def transition, the studios can't afford to drop DVD and only release the HD movie disks. And if they tried to force us to change I think they would be seriously misjudging human tolerance to corpotate manipulation no matter what country a person lives in. I know Americans simply won't be Tread On. I believe this to also be a human trait that does not only apply to a US citizen's revolutionary history of tradition.

Another thing is the pending Hi-Def DVDs may never get into full flight. The public may not want to spend the money for the upgrade. The switch from VHS to DVD was only about twice as expensive for new equiptment. The HD transition is WAY more expensive! Even with the inflationary value of money taken into consideration, I think we are probably talking about 5-10 times more expensive to replace a "full capability" DVD home entertainment rig (TV, Player, Amp, speakers and connection cables) with a system capable of taking full advantage of Hi-def-DVD capabilities.

And the public may still remember the betamax wars and not (this time around) be so stupid as to buy-in immediately. Back then, the choice was no home video at all, or choose/guess between two standards. We don't have that limitation anymore. We can sit back and wait, this time around, while still enjoying entertainment on our present rigs.

It may take so long for player and movie release prices to drop to the point of mass consumer acceptance, and for a resolution to the format war, that some other standard, a more practical, cheaper standard, steps in to take it's place. Do we really need that much room on a disk? I don't mind getting a long movie or special features in a two or three disk set. My DVD 7-Disk Changer/Player resolves that issue for me. I have all seven seasons of Star Trek: The Next Generation in seven lovely individual boxed sets and don't want to spend a quarter of my yearly income on new eqiptment just to have the minor convenience of owning a similar series on a few high capacity HD disks. Not at this point in time anyway. I, personaly, am very happy with the playback quality of a DVD's 480 lines per inch output in Progressive Mode via (red/green/blue) Component Cables to my present HDTV! My amp gives me a fantastic 5.1, 6.1 or 7.1 (matrixed) channels of sound (and I have yet to buy a DVD that even has a 7.1 discrete channel sound track!).

So, I think it would be silly of Elaborate Bytes AG or SlySoft Europe Ltd to expend engineering time and money in providing us with investment protection for backing up Blu-Ray or HD-DVD movies. Please don't get all fired up if you are hot for High Definition-DVD. Or wealthy enough to make an immediate transition. These are just my humble opinions and not truths. Other opinions welcome.

Best regards,
Whisperer

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Last edited by Whisperer1; 07-02-2006 at 23:36. Reason: added content and grammar

All good points. And very well put.

I concur with Whisperer.

Also, one needs to address the HDTV issue. I've heard repeatedly that some high percentage of new sets sold in the USA have HDTV capability, or are HDTV-ready, or something.

Well, I went to my local Wal-Mart.

I couldn't find ANY HDTV's. Or HDTV-ready TV's. Or HDTV-capable TV's. I just found lots of TV's. 100 or so different kinds. Only one or two were flatscreen. None were HDTV.

If it ain't at Wal-Mart, 99% of the country isn't buying it.

HDTV is a myth designed to sell $3000 sets to gullible people with too much disposable income.

Congress is supposedly mandating a LAW saying that ALL TV will be HDTV. It was supposed to happen THIS YEAR. Now it's been pushed back until 2009. I doubt it will happen even then. John Q. Sixpack won't buy a $100 converter for his regular TV. Hell, he hasn't even bought a DVD player yet, or a CD player for that matter! Casettes work just fine.

I agree. Maybe the easiest solution to crack HD-DVD or BlueRay is to crack standalone players (using a Modchip or a modified BIOS of some sort). A standalone player with an ethernet port could be turned into a nice HD-DVD or BlueRay ftp server.

James,
Interesting. The new disks will not only have in data stream CSS protection but this new cable that connects it to the HDTV has to be used too. Have you had a look at the structure of either kind of the new disks? There is some promotional demo stuff released from what I hear. Do you have access to a player?

This sounds like the Windows Vista "super protected monitor" rumor, to me. (In other words, utter bullshit...)

I intend to use an S-Video cable for everything I own. Or component maybe. I guarantee you - with a capital TEE - that any HD-DVD or Blu-Ray box will have every output known to man. The marketing people will do a survey, and John Q. Sixpack will say that they still have a TV that only has red-white-yellow, and they'll put those outputs on the player.

Don't know if the new cable is to be used with Blu-Ray or HD-DVD or both, but this cable has hardware based, "post" copy protection built in and is supposed to only deliver full Hi-Def bandwidth resolution to the correct, matching socket on the next generation of HDTV's (capable of displaying non-interlaced 1024 resolution) if it is an original disk, not a backup disk. Some code identifies the disk to the cable's smart chip as an original or backup. So those who bought HDTV's already have to upgrade AGAIN to get the socket that will deliver 1024 non-interlaced resolution. You will, of course, be able to get present DVD progressive resolution quality by ouputing with a different type of cable to a regular, for example, component socket on the HDTV but without the maximum resolution display inherent in Hi-Def movie releases. Nice trick ya Gurm? They got the suckers where they want them! Buy, buy, buy!

Of course they will. In 480p Resolution (same as progressive Scan DVDs have).
John Q. Sixpack wouldn't notice the difference anyway. But hey, if he doesn't notice, why does he need HD at all?

It's been about a year (something?) since DVD +R DL came out. Today DVD +R DL still costs about $2 (or more) and that is the lowest price I've seen. If DVD +R DL still costs $2 after a year,just wonder how much HD-DVD or Blu-Ray media would be?

Take a look, it's in a book...reading rainbow

"player with an ethernet port" = PC with HD-DVD/BlueRay drive with modified firmware?

I believe that still leaves the problem of a CSS stream to decrypt and a smart cable to the TV that knows the difference between a backup and an original. Am I wrong?

And how would one find, for purchase, an HD player with an ethernet port. We can't just rewire output to ethernet standards in our homes right? Who would dare sell it. Who would dare order it and leave a purchase trail?

No, this won't help you at all. You need a device which can play (decrypt) the encrypted discs on its own. A "stand alone" player.

Give DVDJon a couple of months after HD-DVD/BluRay is released. He seems to think he can crack AACS.

I only have one comment regarding blue-ray/hd-dvd...

"Remember the Betamax!"

(shamelessly stolen from "Remember the Alamo!")

I have to agree with most of the posts prices will drop, or will be a fluke like betamax. Also the average consumer isn't willing to upgade their T.V., DVD Player, Home theater system to get the quality, as for having a converter box to do this I think that'll be just a big joke too, because if you don't have the equipment then the quality isn't there, but besides money spending fools it will be awhile before the average consumer to do such a drastic change(only if they have no choice anymore). The fact that you need to have an ethernet cord to this is just absurd. If they push this too hard they (the movie companies) will be eating their own mess. Blue-Ray for the PC supposed to be coming out in March with the price of $1000 it will be a player/burner. I think it will be a nice thing to have but I am not willing to have cable, internet and the internet to the hd-dvd/blue-ray player just to watch a movie I buy or rent, pay per view will be bigger then I bet.

I see a lot of miss information in this thread.

Blu Ray/HD DVD will be the formats of the future. DVD's thank god will be backwards compatible in the HD DVD/Blu Ray players.

The copy protection having to have an ethernet connection has been rumored but from what has been posted at least for Blu Ray and the Sony Playstation this will not be implimented.

To say that HDTV is barely better than DVD resolution I don't agree with, owning an HDTV the difference between a DVD player and an HD signal is night and day.

Most likely if one format doesn't win out over another we'll probably see players that play both HD-DVD and Blu-Ray down the road. Have to remember Playstation 3 is going to come with Blu-Ray and that will put a large number of units in homes.

futur format will be hd dvd. because blue ray is sony stuff whit root kit protection in it,

Unture...