Old 18-03-2005   #1
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NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Originally PM'ed this to Dee but I have not recieved any reply, so I will try here..

Is there anything in Dee's firmware that would change the writing speeds the drive reports from firmware? Consistantly I get the following from a basic mediainfo query (on CMC MAG/E01 and PRODISC/R03):

INQUIRY: [_NEC ][DVD_RW ND-3520A ][1.U8]
GET [CURRENT] CONFIGURATION:
Mounted Media: 1Bh, DVD+R
Media ID: PRODISC/R03
Current Write Speed: 6.1x1385=8467KB/s
Write Speed #0: 6.1x1385=8467KB/s
Write Speed #1: 5.1x1385=7056KB/s
Write Speed #2: 4.1x1385=5645KB/s
Write Speed #3: 3.1x1385=4234KB/s
Write Speed #4: 2.0x1385=2822KB/s
Write Speed #5: 1.0x1385=1411KB/s
GET [CURRENT] PERFORMANCE:
Write Performance: 4.0x1385=5540KB/s@[0 -> 442367]
6.0x1385=8310KB/s@[442368 -> 2295104]
Speed Descriptor#0: 00/2295104 R@12.0x1385=16620KB/s W@12.0x1385=16620KB/s
Speed Descriptor#1: 00/2295104 R@8.0x1385=11080KB/s W@8.0x1385=11080KB/s
Speed Descriptor#2: 00/2295104 R@8.0x1385=11080KB/s W@6.0x1385=8310KB/s
Speed Descriptor#3: 00/2295104 R@5.0x1385=6925KB/s W@4.0x1385=5540KB/s
READ DISC INFORMATION:
Disc status: blank
Number of Sessions: 1
State of Last Session: empty
Number of Tracks: 1
READ TRACK INFORMATION[#1]:
Track State: blank
Track Start Address: 0*2KB
Next Writable Address: 0*2KB
Free Blocks: 2295104*2KB
Track Size: 2295104*2KB
READ CAPACITY: 1*2048=2048


Problem is, with the drive reporting this, the linux burning programs get confused: growisofs will only write at 12x no matter what I specify, and cdrecord-prodvd only detects 6x as the writable speed, which I don't even think there IS a 6x strategy for these disks? Don't know, I never let it *fully* try to burn the DVD, I CTRL-C during the write countdown

I hope someone can help me fix this


App versions:

Cdrecord-ProDVD-Clone 2.01.01a01 (i686-pc-linux-gnu) Copyright (C) 1995-2004 Jörg Schilling

* growisofs by <appro@fy.chalmers.se>, version 5.21,
front-ending to mkisofs: mkisofs 2.01-unofficial-iconv (i686-pc-linux-gnu)


Thanks!
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Old 18-03-2005   #2
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

I didn't reply because i hadn't had time to look into it.
However, the firmware is fine.
PRODISCR03 has max speed of 12X
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Old 18-03-2005   #3
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Cool.. so is this a NEC firmware difference?
As you can see it reports the writing speeds from 1 to 6x in the table for write speeds..
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Old 18-03-2005   #4
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Here is a media dump from the stock firmware
with a Prodisc R03

** INFO : Drive = _NEC DVD_RW ND-3520A [FW 1.04]
** INFO : Write Capabilities = DVD+RW DVD+R DVD+R-DL
** INFO : Write Capabilities = DVD-RW DVD-R
** INFO : Disc = [DVD+R:PRODISC-R03-003]

** INFO : An Empty Writable Disc Is Recommended For Accurate Results
** INFO : Write Speeds (Supported By This Drive On This Disc) Listed Below

** INFO : GET PERFORMANCE Write Speed Descriptor(s)
Descriptor #1 = 16620 KBPS (12.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
Descriptor #2 = 11080 KBPS ( 8.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
Descriptor #3 = 8310 KBPS ( 6.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
Descriptor #4 = 5540 KBPS ( 4.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
Descriptor #5 = 3324 KBPS ( 2.40x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]

** INFO : MODE SENSE Write Speed Descriptor(s) [Legacy Command]
** INFO : MODE SENSE Is Obsolete And Not Properly Supported By Some Drives
Descriptor #1 = 8467 KBPS ( 6.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
Descriptor #2 = 7056 KBPS ( 5.09x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV] - [Invalid Entry]
Descriptor #3 = 5645 KBPS ( 4.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
Descriptor #4 = 4234 KBPS ( 3.06x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV] - [Invalid Entry]
Descriptor #5 = 2822 KBPS ( 2.04x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV] - [Invalid Entry]
Descriptor #6 = 1411 KBPS ( 1.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
** WARNING : Drive May Have Returned Incorrect Descriptors

This doesn't cause a problem with Suse 9.2 KDE on my system
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Old 18-03-2005   #5
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dee-27
Here is a media dump from the stock firmware
with a Prodisc R03

** INFO : Drive = _NEC DVD_RW ND-3520A [FW 1.04]
** INFO : Write Capabilities = DVD+RW DVD+R DVD+R-DL
** INFO : Write Capabilities = DVD-RW DVD-R
** INFO : Disc = [DVD+R:PRODISC-R03-003]

** INFO : An Empty Writable Disc Is Recommended For Accurate Results
** INFO : Write Speeds (Supported By This Drive On This Disc) Listed Below

** INFO : GET PERFORMANCE Write Speed Descriptor(s)
Descriptor #1 = 16620 KBPS (12.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
Descriptor #2 = 11080 KBPS ( 8.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
Descriptor #3 = 8310 KBPS ( 6.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
Descriptor #4 = 5540 KBPS ( 4.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
Descriptor #5 = 3324 KBPS ( 2.40x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]

** INFO : MODE SENSE Write Speed Descriptor(s) [Legacy Command]
** INFO : MODE SENSE Is Obsolete And Not Properly Supported By Some Drives
Descriptor #1 = 8467 KBPS ( 6.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
Descriptor #2 = 7056 KBPS ( 5.09x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV] - [Invalid Entry]
Descriptor #3 = 5645 KBPS ( 4.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
Descriptor #4 = 4234 KBPS ( 3.06x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV] - [Invalid Entry]
Descriptor #5 = 2822 KBPS ( 2.04x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV] - [Invalid Entry]
Descriptor #6 = 1411 KBPS ( 1.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
** WARNING : Drive May Have Returned Incorrect Descriptors

This doesn't cause a problem with Suse 9.2 KDE on my system
How do you dump this info?
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Old 18-03-2005   #6
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Quote:
Originally Posted by CartmanX
How do you dump this info?
Im in XP at the moment.
I used DVD Identifier http://dvd.identifier.cdfreaks.com/
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Old 18-03-2005   #7
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Quote:
Originally Posted by Dee-27
** INFO : MODE SENSE Write Speed Descriptor(s) [Legacy Command]
** INFO : MODE SENSE Is Obsolete And Not Properly Supported By Some Drives
Descriptor #1 = 8467 KBPS ( 6.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
Descriptor #2 = 7056 KBPS ( 5.09x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV] - [Invalid Entry]
Descriptor #3 = 5645 KBPS ( 4.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
Descriptor #4 = 4234 KBPS ( 3.06x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV] - [Invalid Entry]
Descriptor #5 = 2822 KBPS ( 2.04x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV] - [Invalid Entry]
Descriptor #6 = 1411 KBPS ( 1.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]
** WARNING : Drive May Have Returned Incorrect Descriptors

This doesn't cause a problem with Suse 9.2 KDE on my system
The apps I have tried seem to pull THIS information and apply it as the speed table, not the REAL one that says the REAL speeds. Which program have you used to dump this, and can you post this info please:

dvd+rw-mediainfo /dev/yourwriter

And if you have cdrecord-prodvd: cdrecord-prodvd dev=/dev/yourwriter -prcap

Thanks..
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Old 18-03-2005   #8
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

With Verbatim 8x DVD+R media:

[~]> dvd+rw-mediainfo /dev/hdd
INQUIRY: [_NEC ][DVD_RW ND-3520A ][1.U8]
GET [CURRENT] CONFIGURATION:
Mounted Media: 1Bh, DVD+R
Media ID: MCC/003
Current Write Speed: 6.1x1385=8467KB/s
Write Speed #0: 6.1x1385=8467KB/s
Write Speed #1: 5.1x1385=7056KB/s
Write Speed #2: 4.1x1385=5645KB/s
Write Speed #3: 3.1x1385=4234KB/s
Write Speed #4: 2.0x1385=2822KB/s
Write Speed #5: 1.0x1385=1411KB/s
GET [CURRENT] PERFORMANCE:
Write Performance: 6.0x1385=8310KB/s@[0 -> 360447]
8.0x1385=11080KB/s@[360448 -> 720895]
10.0x1385=13850KB/s@[720896 -> 1155071]
12.0x1385=16620KB/s@[1155072 -> 1543184]
Speed Descriptor#0: 00/1543184 R@12.0x1385=16620KB/s W@12.0x1385=16620KB/s
Speed Descriptor#1: 00/1543184 R@8.0x1385=11080KB/s W@8.0x1385=11080KB/s
Speed Descriptor#2: 00/1543184 R@8.0x1385=11080KB/s W@6.0x1385=8310KB/s
Speed Descriptor#3: 00/1543184 R@5.0x1385=6925KB/s W@4.0x1385=5540KB/s
Speed Descriptor#4: 00/1543184 R@5.0x1385=6925KB/s W@2.4x1385=3324KB/s
READ DVD STRUCTURE[#0h]:
Media Book Type: 01h, DVD-ROM book [revision 1]
Legacy lead-out at: 1543184*2KB=3160440832
READ DISC INFORMATION:
Disc status: complete
Number of Sessions: 1
State of Last Session: complete
Number of Tracks: 1
READ TRACK INFORMATION[#1]:
Track State: partial/complete
Track Start Address: 0*2KB
Free Blocks: 0*2KB
Track Size: 1543184*2KB
FABRICATED TOC:
Track#1 : 17@0
Track#AA : 17@1543184
Multi-session Info: #1@0
READ CAPACITY: 1543184*2048=3160440832
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Old 18-03-2005   #9
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Dee, if you have any could you try to burn a CMC MAG/E01 in linux at 8x? I've tried everything and I cannot get it to burn at 8x .. only 4 and 6 and 12. Specifying -speed=8 to growisofs kicks it to 12x.

Command I used: growisofs -dvd-compat -speed=8 -Z /dev/mywriter=test.iso

NEC's 'buggy' (as Joerg says) Write Speed declaration is messing up alot of linux programs

I don't know if Andy (growisofs author) knows much about this issue, but I have emailed an extensive letter about this problem to him and Joerg.

See: http://lists.debian.org/cdwrite/2005/03/msg00050.html
No response yet....
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Old 18-03-2005   #10
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Quote:
Originally Posted by meff
NEC's 'buggy' (as Joerg says) Write Speed declaration is messing up alot of linux programs
Where does he says that?
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Old 18-03-2005   #11
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Quote:
Originally Posted by CartmanX
Where does he says that?
A couple months ago on the cdwrite mailing list, referring to an older NEC drive.
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Old 18-03-2005   #12
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Ok, I flashed from 1.U8 and tested. then flashed back to stock 1.04 firmware.
With a media that is capable of burning at 12X. 8X burn speed, although available cannot be used as a burn speed, in either firmware.

Again using stock firmware with a MCC003 which is 8X max with stock firmware. 8X is selectable and does work.

See pic below

I don't know if this is a bug in growisofs or NEC, i will try later with a 16X media.
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Old 19-03-2005   #13
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Cool, I appreciate you looking into it Dee
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Old 19-03-2005   #14
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Just to update.
Media that can be burned at 16X.
8x burn speed can be selected, but won't burn at 8X with Stock or Modified firmware.
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Old 19-03-2005   #15
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Suckage

Well, as I have posted above, I've reported this problem to Andy and Joerg.. I guess we will have to see how it goes from there..
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Old 19-03-2005   #16
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Got a reply: http://lists.debian.org/cdwrite/2005/03/msg00056.html

Quote:
NEC 35x0 drives report crap answers on mode_sense page 2A when DVD media is mounted. The available write speeds on DVDs can only be requested using get_performance.
Looks like it's going to be something that needs fixing on the app side, unless there is some way to modify the firmware to show correct answers for mode_sense, but that'd be (if even possible) way too much work for Dee with me and a few others being the minority that use this drive under Linux
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Old 19-03-2005   #17
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Quote:
Originally Posted by meff
Got a reply: http://lists.debian.org/cdwrite/2005/03/msg00056.html



Looks like it's going to be something that needs fixing on the app side, unless there is some way to modify the firmware to show correct answers for mode_sense, but that'd be (if even possible) way too much work for Dee with me and a few others being the minority that use this drive under Linux
Well I hope it gets fixed in growisofs at least as cdrecord-proDVD is not free*(as in speech) software.
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Old 19-03-2005   #18
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

If anyone of you also has windows, you can look at the NEC firmware mess using this
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Old 19-03-2005   #19
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

@alexnoe: Do you have any idea how to fix this in the meantime, or do we have to wait for Andy or Joerg?
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Old 19-03-2005   #20
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

On windows, I have made an aspi dll which intercepts SET STREAMING commands before they are passed to the real wnaspi32.dll and replaces the write speed with whatever I want. Maybe something like this is possible on Linux as well?
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Old 19-03-2005   #21
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Quote:
Originally Posted by alexnoe
On windows, I have made an aspi dll which intercepts SET STREAMING commands before they are passed to the real wnaspi32.dll and replaces the write speed with whatever I want. Maybe something like this is possible on Linux as well?
I'm sure that'd be pretty easy to implement for NEC drives by Andy or Joerg, but I myself am not a C coder

I haven't got any replies back from either of them.
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Old 19-03-2005   #22
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Not sure if it is the same problem as one reported several times on the list, but there is a bug in growisofs, it assumes that the lowest speed is 1x. Andy knows about it and it should be fixed in next release.

In meantime you can try speed=2 for 8x speed.
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Old 20-03-2005   #23
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Quote:
Originally Posted by tar
Not sure if it is the same problem as one reported several times on the list, but there is a bug in growisofs, it assumes that the lowest speed is 1x. Andy knows about it and it should be fixed in next release.

In meantime you can try speed=2 for 8x speed.
I have been using a 'test' DVD for each of my blank types that I keep appending small tracks to with different -speed= settings in the meantime to get it to record the speed I want, then use that to burn something. It's a pain in the ass though.. See below.

Here are some tests with a 'CMC MAG/E01':

dvd+rw-mediainfo:
INQUIRY: [_NEC ][DVD_RW ND-3520A ][1.U8]
GET [CURRENT] CONFIGURATION:
Mounted Media: 1Bh, DVD+R
Media ID: CMC MAG/E01
Current Write Speed: 6.1x1385=8467KB/s
Write Speed #0: 6.1x1385=8467KB/s
Write Speed #1: 5.1x1385=7056KB/s
Write Speed #2: 4.1x1385=5645KB/s
Write Speed #3: 3.1x1385=4234KB/s
Write Speed #4: 2.0x1385=2822KB/s
Write Speed #5: 1.0x1385=1411KB/s
GET [CURRENT] PERFORMANCE:
Write Performance: 6.0x1385=8310KB/s@[0 -> 360447]
8.0x1385=11080KB/s@[360448 -> 720895]
10.0x1385=13850KB/s@[720896 -> 1155071]
12.0x1385=16620KB/s@[1155072 -> 2295104]
Speed Descriptor#0: 00/2295104 R@12.0x1385=16620KB/s W@12.0x1385=16620KB/s
Speed Descriptor#1: 00/2295104 R@8.0x1385=11080KB/s W@8.0x1385=11080KB/s
Speed Descriptor#2: 00/2295104 R@8.0x1385=11080KB/s W@6.0x1385=8310KB/s
Speed Descriptor#3: 00/2295104 R@5.0x1385=6925KB/s W@4.0x1385=5540KB/s

Using 'brute force' to figure out what the heck -speed= flag is for the speed I want to burn at:
-speed=1: /dev/optical1: "Current Write Speed" is 4.1x1385KBps.
-speed=2: /dev/optical1: "Current Write Speed" is 4.1x1385KBps.
-speed=3: /dev/optical1: "Current Write Speed" is 6.1x1385KBps.
-speed=4: /dev/optical1: "Current Write Speed" is 6.1x1385KBps.
-speed=5: /dev/optical1: "Current Write Speed" is 8.2x1385KBps.
-speed=6: /dev/optical1: "Current Write Speed" is 12.3x1385KBps.
-speed=7: /dev/optical1: "Current Write Speed" is 12.3x1385KBps.
-speed=8: /dev/optical1: "Current Write Speed" is 12.3x1385KBps.
-speed=9: /dev/optical1: "Current Write Speed" is 12.3x1385KBps.
-speed=10: /dev/optical1: "Current Write Speed" is 12.3x1385KBps.
-speed=11: /dev/optical1: "Current Write Speed" is 12.3x1385KBps.
-speed=12: /dev/optical1: "Current Write Speed" is 12.3x1385KBps.

How the above is relative to the dvd+rw-mediainfo output.. I don't know.. Heh.

On my 'PRODISC/R03' blanks, using -speed=7 burns at 8, which is different than this output also.

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Old 20-05-2007   #24
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

I know it normally isn't a good idea to "digg out" old topics, especially not if 2 years old , but what is discussed here, is exactly what STILL happens, at this moment to me with a NEC drive (Optiarc 7173) with growisofs and cdrkit/cdrecord.
Cdrecord or wodim select the write speed out of the "buggy" report SENSE_MODE giving me always 6x speed, growisofs does select proper 18 or 16x speed, but ends up burning in 6x speed aswell!
So, I just wanted to ask (hope this get to who participated in this thread...) if anyone of you found a solution to this. Or if the authors of growisofs and cdrecord answered at the time.
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Old 20-05-2007   #25
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Re: NEC ND-3520A + 1.U8 + Linux

Well, proven that it REALLY is no good idea to digg out old post ehehe
I mean: problem solved. My problem (slow dvd write speed) actually had nothing to do with the problem listed here, it was due to slowdowns. Growisofs afterall did perfectly well select the right write speed, even with wrong entries shown in dvd+rw-mediainfo.
Only cdrecord/cdrkit suffers from this (starts always with 6x ) but at least for me that's irrelevant, as I never use it to burn dvd...
So, sorry for digging this out lolol
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