Can't burn at 48x/16x with 3500A (was: Nec 3500a problem)

Neo4 · 14-12-2004

hy guys,
i've bought a nec 3500a and i'm having some problems because i can't record cds faster than 32x and dvd than 12X!
and the most strang thing is the information that is given by alcohol!
with no cd on the drive:

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with cd:

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the speed changes and the cds are 52x form EMTEC...
and with dvds is the oposite with no dvd the maxium is 6x to record and with dvd on the drive is 12x but it shoulb be 16x!
i have a pentium 3 850 with windows2000
thanks.

*Quikee* · 14-12-2004

3500 doesn't allow to burn all media at 48x... so just live with it.. and it also doesn't allow you to burn any kind of DVD media at 16x. The 6x max with no disc in the drive is normal.

Neo4 · 14-12-2004

but when i put only a 8x dvd the max speed go to 12x, shouldn't they go only to 8x by that logic?
why i can't record cds faster than 32x if they are 52x? i've recorded a iso file
my firmware version is 2.16 do you recomend the update?
thanks

*Quikee* · 14-12-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neo4

but when i put only a 8x dvd the max speed go to 12x, shouldn't they go only to 8x by that logic?

The allowed write speeds are set in the firmware of the drive. So for some disc the firmware allows to be burned on higher speeds and for some it limits the speed.. all depends of the mediacode(MID) of the disc. For example 8x YUDEN000T02 is allowed to be burned at 16x but 16x PHILIPSC16 is only allowed to be burned at 8x

This things can be manipulated for DVD disc.. that's why there are LD and my firmware that allows higher speeds for even 4x media..

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neo4

why i can't record cds faster than 32x if they are 52x? i've recorded a iso file
my firmware version is 2.16 do you recomend the update?
thanks

As I said.. this is set in the firmware and you can't do anything about it.. If you want to burn with higher speed just by some Ritek CD media that burns at 48x... but it's recommended not to go faster than 32x anyway.
Firmware upgrade is allway recommended.. new firmware usualy give you higher quality burns and more supported MIDs.. Upgrade to the latest 2.18 firmware.. but it may not solve your "problems".

Neo4 · 14-12-2004

what i think because what you said and from the observation is:
the nec 3500a see what my system is caple of and sets me maxium speed depending on the media and system capabilities?
before this drive i have an cd drive that is capable of 40x max speed for record and in the alcohol during the recording the real max speed didn´t go faster than 24x!
and with alcohol at 32x the real speed is 24X too, so i've concluded by miself that the nec 3500a see what my system is caple of and sets me maxium speed depending on the media and system capabilities.
i don't know if this is truth...so if i canched my system to a p4 or amd 64 i could record faster than 32x
an i right or i'snt right what i've said?
if its rigth thats prety cool!

*Quikee* · 14-12-2004

No.. the drive doesn't looks for your system capabilities at all! I never said that... the speed is set in the firmware of the drive... for every drive with the same firmware. How many times I have to say this it DEPENDS ON THE DISC (actually MediaCode or MID) what is the maximum speed!
However you're right... Alcohol can limit your speed... depending of your system capabilities... but you'll be never able to burn above the speeds that the disc reports.
And also this... if it says on the disc 52x... it doesn't mean you'll be able to burn it at that speed... it only means it's capeable to be burned with this speed.

Example: You have this shiny new 100x capable(!) disc.. Alcohol reports max write speed 24x with Nec.. That means you'll be never able to burn this disc faster - unless you change the firmware of the drive that will support faster speeds with this disc. Got it ?

Neo4 · 15-12-2004

i've understanding what you say.
so, if i have a 100x capable disc and acohol reports max at 24x and the max nec suport is 48x, this 24x is because my system can't send so quick the information to the drive. am i righ or i'm still saying wrong things?
sorry about that :S
thanks a lot[]

*cnlson* · 15-12-2004

some men you just can't reach as so you get what we have here today... and i don't like it any more than you men --Strother Martin in Cool Hand Luke

pay close attention:

Quote:

Originally Posted by Quikee2

it DEPENDS ON THE DISC (actually MediaCode or MID) what is the maximum speed!

what he means is that the when the drive manufacturers test media they determine what speeds it will burn at for their burner and then LIMIT it to that speed or below. cheap cd media may claim higher speeds but at those higher speeds it will not be readable after being written.

to check the mid codes quikee2 references you need something like dvdinfopro (try and stay away from this one actually) or can someone else throw me a bone? which will display the following info :

Media Information

Format Capacity Not Formatted
Free Blocks 736958464
Free Capacity 702.82MB(736.96MB)
Media Type CD-R
ATIP Start Time of Lead In (Media Code) 97m15s17f
ATIP Last Possible Start Time of Lead Out 79m59s70f
Manufacturer Name Ritek Co.
HD-BURN Certified YES
Available Write Descriptor CAV 48.0x 7200KBps
Available Write Descriptor CAV 40.0x 6000KBps
Available Write Descriptor CAV 32.0x 4800KBps
Available Write Descriptor CAV 24.0x 3600KBps
Available Write Descriptor CLV 16.0x 2400KBps
Available Write Descriptor CLV 8.0x 1200KBps

and here is a supposed 52x that will only burn at 32:

Media Information

Format Capacity Not Formatted
Free Blocks 736966656
Free Capacity 702.83MB(736.97MB)
Media Type CD-R
ATIP Start Time of Lead In (Media Code) 97m34s22f
ATIP Last Possible Start Time of Lead Out 79m59s74f
Manufacturer Name Mitsubishi Chemical Corporation
HD-BURN Certified NO
Available Write Descriptor CAV 32.0x 4800KBps
Available Write Descriptor CAV 24.0x 3600KBps
Available Write Descriptor CLV 16.0x 2400KBps
Available Write Descriptor CLV 8.0x 1200KBps

get it now? since there is only about a minute difference in burning a cd @ 32x and 48x you should remain calm and buy better media next time. or why not post in the media forum since you are asking about media?

*pinto2* · 15-12-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by cnlson

to check the mid codes quikee2 references you need something like dvdinfopro (try and stay away from this one actually) or can someone else throw me a bone? which will display the following info...

Okay, here is your bone...

DVD Identifier

Code:

--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Unique Disc Identifier : [DVD-R:SONY08D1]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
Disc Type :              [DVD-R]
Manufacturer ID :        [SONY08D1]
Manufacturer Name :      [Sony Corp.]
Disc Application Code :  [Unrestricted Use : Consumer Purpose]
Recording Speeds :       [1x , 2x , 4x , 6x , 8x]
Blank Disc Capacity :    [2,298,496 Sectors = 4,489.3MB = 4.38GB (4.71GB)]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------
[DVD Identifier - http://DVD.Identifier.CDfreaks.com]
--------------------------------------------------------------------------

** INFO : GET PERFORMANCE Write Speed Descriptor(s)
Descriptor #1 = 11080 KBPS ( 8.00x) - [CLV/Non-Pure CAV]

*cnlson* · 15-12-2004

thx pinto but that is for dvd not cd media and i can't remember a util for necs to show this info. with liteons it was smartburn but i have no idea what to use for nec burners

*code65536* · 15-12-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by cnlson

thx pinto but that is for dvd not cd media and i can't remember a util for necs to show this info. with liteons it was smartburn but i have no idea what to use for nec burners

Does KProbe's Disc Info work? The command to retreive available write decriptors should be universal for all burners.

Nero CD/DVD speed's media info should also do the trick, methinks. Haven't tried it with CD media, though.

*cnlson* · 15-12-2004

kprobe - yes
cdspeed - no

or just take the word of the program you are burning with

Neo4 · 15-12-2004

but do all dvd drives do what this nec do, or only some new can do that?
when i used the samsung cdrw recorder no mater what cd i put and the max speed was always 40x.
one more thing...
when i recorded the dvds at 12x it long 20m for recording that's very much for 12x!
with my dvdr the dvd identifier says:

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this says on top that the max speed is 8x and in the end says 12x!

what program should i use to see cds info?
tnhaks a lot for the help guys[]

Neo4 · 16-12-2004

help me please :S

FastAssEG · 17-12-2004

Quote:

Originally Posted by Neo4

help me please :S

WOW!!!

What they wrote is self explanatory.

Simple.The firmware (which is shown as Product Revision Level in Alcohol= yours is 2.16) selects the speed not your Computer. The best speed for the media is preset by NEC, so u don't make yourself coasters for when u have company over. Do u get it.

Logic is. Just cause it says 52x doesn't mean that's whats best for it.

If u want media that will burn at 48x try TDK.

Neo4 · 17-12-2004

yes i've understood that but why does the dvd identifyer gives 2 diferent max speeds to me?
thanks[]

*KTL* · 17-12-2004

You see 2 different speeds because 1) TYG02 is "physically" an 8x-only disc, and 2) NEC's firmware of 2.16 (that you're currently using) is "capable" of writing at 12x, because NEC deems the TYG02 disc as having the same quality result as an 8x (or lower) burn.

14-12-2004	#2
Quikee Author of NecDump Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Maribor, Slovenia Posts: 2,780	Re: Nec 3500a problem 3500 doesn't allow to burn all media at 48x... so just live with it.. and it also doesn't allow you to burn any kind of DVD media at 16x. The 6x max with no disc in the drive is normal. __________________ NecDump, WOPC Tool, BQFlasher 0.7.2 (+source), DVDScanner, DVDWrite,...

14-12-2004	#3
Neo4 New on Forum Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 8	Re: Nec 3500a problem but when i put only a 8x dvd the max speed go to 12x, shouldn't they go only to 8x by that logic? why i can't record cds faster than 32x if they are 52x? i've recorded a iso file my firmware version is 2.16 do you recomend the update? thanks

14-12-2004	#5
Neo4 New on Forum Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 8	Re: Nec 3500a problem what i think because what you said and from the observation is: the nec 3500a see what my system is caple of and sets me maxium speed depending on the media and system capabilities? before this drive i have an cd drive that is capable of 40x max speed for record and in the alcohol during the recording the real max speed didn´t go faster than 24x! and with alcohol at 32x the real speed is 24X too, so i've concluded by miself that the nec 3500a see what my system is caple of and sets me maxium speed depending on the media and system capabilities. i don't know if this is truth...so if i canched my system to a p4 or amd 64 i could record faster than 32x an i right or i'snt right what i've said? if its rigth thats prety cool! Last edited by Neo4; 14-12-2004 at 21:45.

14-12-2004	#6
Quikee Author of NecDump Join Date: Aug 2004 Location: Maribor, Slovenia Posts: 2,780	Re: Nec 3500a problem No.. the drive doesn't looks for your system capabilities at all! I never said that... the speed is set in the firmware of the drive... for every drive with the same firmware. How many times I have to say this it DEPENDS ON THE DISC (actually MediaCode or MID) what is the maximum speed! However you're right... Alcohol can limit your speed... depending of your system capabilities... but you'll be never able to burn above the speeds that the disc reports. And also this... if it says on the disc 52x... it doesn't mean you'll be able to burn it at that speed... it only means it's capeable to be burned with this speed. Example: You have this shiny new 100x capable(!) disc.. Alcohol reports max write speed 24x with Nec.. That means you'll be never able to burn this disc faster - unless you change the firmware of the drive that will support faster speeds with this disc. Got it ? __________________ NecDump, WOPC Tool, BQFlasher 0.7.2 (+source), DVDScanner, DVDWrite,...

15-12-2004	#7
Neo4 New on Forum Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 8	Re: Can't burn at 48x/16x with 3500A (was: Nec 3500a problem) i've understanding what you say. so, if i have a 100x capable disc and acohol reports max at 24x and the max nec suport is 48x, this 24x is because my system can't send so quick the information to the drive. am i righ or i'm still saying wrong things? sorry about that :S thanks a lot[] Last edited by Neo4; 15-12-2004 at 01:16.

14-12-2004	#1
Neo4 New on Forum Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 8	Can't burn at 48x/16x with 3500A (was: Nec 3500a problem) hy guys, i've bought a nec 3500a and i'm having some problems because i can't record cds faster than 32x and dvd than 12X! and the most strang thing is the information that is given by alcohol! with no cd on the drive: Embedded Images View/download images and remove advertisements by registering now! (it's easy, free and takes less than a minute) You must be registered in order view images in this forum. with cd: Embedded Images View/download images and remove advertisements by registering now! (it's easy, free and takes less than a minute) You must be registered in order view images in this forum. the speed changes and the cds are 52x form EMTEC... and with dvds is the oposite with no dvd the maxium is 6x to record and with dvd on the drive is 12x but it shoulb be 16x! i have a pentium 3 850 with windows2000 thanks.

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15-12-2004	#10
cnlson CDFreaks Resident Join Date: Oct 2003 Posts: 2,223	Re: Can't burn at 48x/16x with 3500A (was: Nec 3500a problem) thx pinto but that is for dvd not cd media and i can't remember a util for necs to show this info. with liteons it was smartburn but i have no idea what to use for nec burners __________________ When you flirt with death, you run the risk that death has something more serious in mind. -- Current optical hardware Maddog Megastor 16x (Nec 3500) x2 Nec 3540 Liteon 1633 USB Ext (scanning and ripping only) Liteon 48161H Liteon 52246 USB Ext -- Retired: Maddog DOMINATOR 8x (Nec 2500) x2 benq 1620 (returned) nice catch quickee , 4012EU Liteon 811s, 411s, 48161H usb 2.0 ext, 52246, 48246, 40125, ltd-163 LG 8400, 8163 Plex r820ti S& F Rocket RW (Sanyo RW1) Ext Scsi x 2,SpeedWriter 4012 (teac r55s) Ext Scsi Hp 7200E

16-12-2004	#14
Neo4 New on Forum Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 8	Re: Can't burn at 48x/16x with 3500A (was: Nec 3500a problem) help me please :S

17-12-2004	#16
Neo4 New on Forum Join Date: Dec 2004 Posts: 8	Re: Can't burn at 48x/16x with 3500A (was: Nec 3500a problem) yes i've understood that but why does the dvd identifyer gives 2 diferent max speeds to me? thanks[]

17-12-2004	#17
KTL MyCE Resident Join Date: Jan 2003 Location: Chicago Posts: 3,283	Re: Can't burn at 48x/16x with 3500A (was: Nec 3500a problem) You see 2 different speeds because 1) TYG02 is "physically" an 8x-only disc, and 2) NEC's firmware of 2.16 (that you're currently using) is "capable" of writing at 12x, because NEC deems the TYG02 disc as having the same quality result as an 8x (or lower) burn. __________________ Codeguys Binflash - Liggy/Dee How To: Identify MTK A/B- or NEC Y-based LiteOn drives Get CD-DVD Speed 4.7.7.16 SE3 Change Buffer Size in CD-DVD Speed Enable SolidBurn in CD-DVD Speed Enable Samsung Scanning in CD-DVD Speed Show Nero Burning Speed Remove upper and lower filters Check Silicon Image add-on controller cards

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