Old 22-12-2005   #1
New on Forum
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 9
How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

I am using a Pioneer DVR-108 writer with the latest firmware version.
I have copied many DVD movies before successfully using DVD Shhrink, DVDFab and CloneDVD usually to split a movie onto 2 discs.
This is the first time I tried copying to a Dual Layer disc but with no success.

I used the latest CloneDVD and AnyDVD by Slysoft to rip Fantastic 4 onto the hard drive set at DVD+R DL quality, output method DVD files. The movie played fine on the hard drive. Then I tried to Nero Burning ROM 6.6.0.3 to burn the movie onto a Fujifilm DVD+R Double Layer disc at 2.4x speed (only speed available and speed written on the disc). The first half of the disc was burning fine but when Nero tried to burn onto the second layer of the disc it gave me an error messsage like "target failed". I am wondering what went wrong?

Right now I am hoping that CloneDVD can burn it onto the DL disc (I am not confident my Nero can do it) but I wanted to make sure from you guys if CloneDVD can burn onto a dual layer disc using the "Write Existing Data" option? before I waste another expensive DL disc. The movie is still in the hard drive. Do I have to choose the output method "DVD writer"?

I also have DVDFab Gold 2.82 which also claims to be able to burn onto a a DL disc. Can it? What other programs can burn the movie onto a DL disc?
trilite is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-12-2005   #2
CDFreaks Resident
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,940
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Dual Layer burning is a black art.

The only sure way to get it to work - assuming your drive and media can handle it - is to use DVD Decrypter.

Mode->ISO READ
Mode->ISO WRITE

That's it!
Gurm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-12-2005   #3
New on Forum
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 9
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

So DVDFab Gold won't work for DL burning?

I always thought that 1Click DVD Copy specialized in that.
trilite is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-12-2005   #4
CD Freaks Member
 
asfaltpiloot's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2005
Location: Netherlands
Posts: 104
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Try upgrading to Nero 6.6.0.18
I have good experience with DVD Decrypter, has something to do with the layerbreak.
Like Gurm said it's a tricky thing.
__________________
Lite-on 451@832 VS0M (sold)
NEC 3520 with Liggy and Dee's 2.U5

BenQ DW1650
HP dvd840 @ LG GSA 4166B (RIP)

Smokin' Tires Not Drugs
asfaltpiloot is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-12-2005   #5
New on Forum
 
Join Date: Nov 2005
Posts: 9
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

So should I rip it to the hard drive first before I burn to DL media?
trilite is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 22-12-2005   #6
MyCE Resident
 
reasonsnotrules's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 5,328
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trilite
So should I rip it to the hard drive first before I burn to DL media?
yes, and make sure you do the ripping with dvd decrypter. this is what creates the copy with the info to keep the layer break intact.
reasonsnotrules is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-12-2005   #7
CD Freaks Senior Member
 
sonoluca's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2005
Location: czech republic
Posts: 279
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

http://www.imgburn.com/
__________________

BenQ DW1640 BSLB
LG GSA-4163B A106
Pionner DVR-112 1.09
sonoluca is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-12-2005   #8
CD Freaks Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Vancouver, U.S.A.
Posts: 33
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by trilite
I am using a Pioneer DVR-108 writer with the latest firmware version.


I used the latest CloneDVD and AnyDVD by Slysoft to rip Fantastic 4 onto the hard drive set at DVD+R DL quality, output method DVD files. The movie played fine on the hard drive. Then I tried to Nero Burning ROM 6.6.0.3 to burn the movie onto a Fujifilm DVD+R Double Layer disc at 2.4x speed (only speed available and speed written on the disc). The first half of the disc was burning fine but when Nero tried to burn onto the second layer of the disc it gave me an error messsage like "target failed". I am wondering what went wrong?

Right now I am hoping that CloneDVD can burn it onto the DL disc (I am not confident my Nero can do it) but I wanted to make sure from you guys if CloneDVD can burn onto a dual layer disc using the "Write Existing Data" option? before I waste another expensive DL disc. The movie is still in the hard drive. Do I have to choose the output method "DVD writer"?
I've successfully burned several movies using Verbatim DVD+R DL blanks (MKM 001) this past week. Clone DVD2 and AnyDVD is the only programs used. BenQ 1640 is the burner used. Using CDSpeed to test the discs shows the quality at 95%. The movies were almost 8 gigs each. And they played just fine in my cheap DVD standalone. No coasters yet.
Not sure why you want to use Nero when you have CloneDVD.
Yes, use DVD Writer as the output method.
amboyna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-12-2005   #9
MyCE Resident
 
reasonsnotrules's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 5,328
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by sonoluca
so as not to confuse the original poster, i just want to mention that dvd decrypter and imgburn are essentially interchangeable. I'd recommend either one since they're essentially the same program by the same author.

(imgburn is an updated version without the decryption capabilities...legal stuff)

i guess technically imgburn would be the way to go since it's more recent...I still say dvd decrypter out of habit sometimes though.
reasonsnotrules is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-12-2005   #10
CDFreaks Resident
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,940
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

I fail to understand why people use CloneDVD for dual-layer backups.

Your source... and your destination... are the same size. Why use a transcoder at all?

The problem here is the layer break. The layers are NOT the exact same size on the original versus the dual-layer. And many programs (*cough*Nero*cough*1click*cough*) have huge problems translating the layer break.

Just read the ISO, and write the ISO.

Embedded Images

View/download images and remove advertisements by registering now! (it's easy, free and takes less than a minute)

You must be registered in order view images in this forum.

Embedded Images

View/download images and remove advertisements by registering now! (it's easy, free and takes less than a minute)

You must be registered in order view images in this forum.
Gurm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-12-2005   #11
Retired Moderator
 
AZImmortal's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2003
Posts: 2,941
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

yeah, the use of dvd decrypter is essential for dual-layer copying in order to preserve the layer break. just use iso read/write modes as Gurm has instructed and be sure to write using the .mds file.
__________________
Vob Blanker | DvdReMake (Pro)

I don't respond to questions through PM that should be asked in the forum
AZImmortal is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-12-2005   #12
CD Freaks Die Hard
 
Whisperer1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,381
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

AZImmortal,
When do you think CloneDVD might update with tru-to-the-original layer break detection?

Only asking you because a guy with 2643 posts may have heard something from the inside(?)

Thanks,
Whisperer
Finally got the holiday spirit today (my b-day). Happy Holidays to all members.
Whisperer1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-12-2005   #13
CDFreaks Resident
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,940
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whisperer1
AZImmortal,
When do you think CloneDVD might update with tru-to-the-original layer break detection?
Why would they add this functionality? There aren't ANY commercial DVD's (to my knowledge) that are bigger than a DVD+R/DL, so why use a transcoder? That's just not what it's for! I can't see it being high on Slysoft's to-do list.
Gurm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 23-12-2005   #14
CD Freaks Die Hard
 
Whisperer1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,381
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gurm
Why would they add this functionality? There aren't ANY commercial DVD's (to my knowledge) that are bigger than a DVD+R/DL, so why use a transcoder? That's just not what it's for! I can't see it being high on Slysoft's to-do list.
You keep posting that (!) so I guess you feel pretty strongly about it. A 1:1 DL backup is not transcoding. I never compress. I use CloneDVD's Split feature for now: DL in the near future when media prices drop to commodity levels and CloneDVD updates. On a data packed original, not having a true layer break can cause problems fitting the originals layers onto the backups layers. And I don't want to use all the freeware. Just waiting for my favorite backup program add this feature which Olli, some time ago, indicated was on his "list".

Best regards,
Whisperer
Whisperer1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 24-12-2005   #15
CDFreaks Resident
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,940
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whisperer1
You keep posting that (!) so I guess you feel pretty strongly about it. A 1:1 DL backup is not transcoding. I never compress. I use CloneDVD's Split feature for now: DL in the near future when media prices drop to commodity levels and CloneDVD updates. On a data packed original, not having a true layer break can cause problems fitting the originals layers onto the backups layers. And I don't want to use all the freeware. Just waiting for my favorite backup program add this feature which Olli, some time ago, indicated was on his "list".

Best regards,
Whisperer
It's not that I feel strongly about this particular thing, it's that I'm not a huge fan of blindly trying to use one program for everything.
Gurm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-12-2005   #16
CD Freaks Die Hard
 
Whisperer1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,381
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Gurm,
Ya, understandable. And possibly more fun and challenge. Me ... I got so much going on in my life that I like getting comfortable with one interface (not talking about my girlfriend) so i can just backup my new movie purchases quickly and without alot of effort. Took me quite a while to backup my pre-existing collection, though, but thats all over now.

Like you said "Dual Layer burning is a black art" at this moment. But soon burner manufactures will all be on the same page as far as booktyping by default and quality DL media will drop in price to commodity levels. CloneDVD will have to evolve & upgrade it's DL capabilities (SL bitsetting & true layer breaking) in order to survive against it's competitors. Because in a year, nobody will be compressing and nobody will be splitting. Everone will be backing up dual layer. I, for one, would gladly pay an upgrade fee to cover Elby's development expenses (CloneDVD3!).

Even with HD coming, I'll bet we still have 5-7 years of DVD releases to look forward to before more than 50% of American households switch over to HD movie disks and player equipment. Even now (1996 to almost 2006) households are only at 80% DVD vs VHS. And Elby can make alot of money in those 5-7 years.

Best regards,
Whisperer

Last edited by Whisperer1; 25-12-2005 at 06:40.
Whisperer1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-12-2005   #17
CDFreaks Resident
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,940
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whisperer1
Gurm,
Ya, understandable. And possibly more fun and challenge. Me ... I got so much going on in my life that I like getting comfortable with one interface (not talking about my girlfriend) so i can just backup my new movie purchases quickly and without alot of effort. Took me quite a while to backup my pre-existing collection, though, but thats all over now.
Ok, that I do understand.

Quote:
Like you said "Dual Layer burning is a black art" at this moment. But soon burner manufactures will all be on the same page as far as booktyping by default and quality DL media will drop in price to commodity levels.
No, they really won't. We've discussed it before, but Dual-layer burning will NEVER be viable. By the time they start to sort out the problems (mind you, dual-layer media has been available for almost two years already, dual-layer burners just as long), HD-DVD or Blu-Ray will be here. Many people feel that dual-layer media will NEVER be cheap enough for everyone to use it. Add to that the fact that MOST set-top players play +R or -R, but RELATIVELY FEW play +R/DL... and you can see my point.

[/quote]CloneDVD will have to evolve & upgrade it's DL capabilities (SL bitsetting & true layer breaking) in order to survive against it's competitors. [/quote]

Why? This is what I don't get. WHY is this a MUST-HAVE feature? If you have a dual-layer drive, just read the image and write the image. I like CloneDVD as much as the next guy, but it's a transcoder. The fact that it CAN split discs is immaterial. It was intended as a transcoder. Mode->ISO Read, Mode->ISO Write. Eventually, Nero will just handle it. Just hit "copy disc" and you'll end up with the layer break in the right place.

Quote:
Because in a year, nobody will be compressing and nobody will be splitting. Everone will be backing up dual layer.
Again, you're way off the mark with this assessment. But regardless, it doesn't matter.

Olli has said that eventually there will be enough demand that he'll write some kind of program like DVD Decrypter. An image ripper/writer. That's the program you'll want to use, not CloneDVD.

Like I said, I'm not big on trying to use a program to do something it was never intended to do simply because you're comfortable with it. Many people are comfortable with Microsoft Word, but that doesn't mean that Microsoft should go out of their way to add non-word-processing functionality to it. Word doesn't edit WAV files, and shouldn't! I know that's a silly example, but how about one closer to home? You can spend all day and night beating yourself up trying to get Word to do page layout on a large scale for publishing, or you can simply switch to a program that's intended for that purpose - if you like MS's interface, you can use Publisher. Or, Adobe makes several fine layout programs (Framemaker, Pagemaker, InDesign) that do what you need.

The fact that Word CAN be MADE to do page layout doesn't mean it was intended for that purpose, or is even the best program for that purpose.

And before you go on about the cost - the program you want/need ( DVD Decrypter) is FREE. Getting harder to download, this is true. But it's FREE. And it's EASY. There is no learning curve. Download it, run it, and hit the big CD button. Simple!
Gurm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-12-2005   #18
CD Freaks Die Hard
 
Whisperer1's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Posts: 1,381
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Gurm
You sound like your background may be marketing. Mine too. I can just see us at a board meeting, arguing across a conference table about marketing trends and upgrading or adding to the product line.

Since I believe some elements of both of our differing opinions are valid but that neither of our different opinions are really so vital that they must become true, we can afford to just sit back and see what unfolds over the next year.

Till then, my well spoken friend.

Whisperer
Whisperer1 is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 25-12-2005   #19
CDFreaks Resident
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,940
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Whisperer1
Gurm
You sound like your background may be marketing. Mine too. I can just see us at a board meeting, arguing across a conference table about marketing trends and upgrading or adding to the product line.

Since I believe some elements of both of our differing opinions are valid but that neither of our different opinions are really so vital that they must become true, we can afford to just sit back and see what unfolds over the next year.

Till then, my well spoken friend.

Whisperer
Fair enough. I do see your point about just wanting one program that backs up DVD's.

But I'll put money on Dual-layer never being really viable. And by really viable I mean "works in 99% of set-top boxes and burns properly with all burning programs and media is 50 cents each". Just won't happen, I'll wager good cash.
Gurm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-12-2005   #20
CD Freaks Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Vancouver, U.S.A.
Posts: 33
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

[QUOTE=Gurm]I fail to understand why people use CloneDVD for dual-layer backups.

It seems I missed quite a bit while I was draining bottles over the holiday. First of all, I am very new to burning. I use CloneDVD because I know the program and it works. I just started doing DL burns last week. Again, I used CloneDVD and it worked. Burning my factory copies of Deadwood on a SL blank caused too much compression and bad discs. With Any DVD running in the background all is good.
So I fail to see what I am doing wrong. Enlighten me please.
__________________
Old System:
Athlon XP2000
TI 4600 Video Card
Raptor 34 gig SATA HD
BenQ 1640A DVD Writer
Firefox!!!
New rig data coming soon!
____________________
amp: Yamaha DSP-A1.
TV: Pioneer Elite Pro FHD 1
DVD: Toshiba HD XA-2.
LD: Pioneer CLD-97 w/AC-3.
HD tuner: LG LSS-3200A.
Speakers: Monitor Audio Silver.
Velodyne 12" Sub.
amboyna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-12-2005   #21
MyCE Resident
 
reasonsnotrules's Avatar
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Location: Massachusetts
Posts: 5,328
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

[QUOTE=amboyna]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Gurm
I fail to understand why people use CloneDVD for dual-layer backups.

It seems I missed quite a bit while I was draining bottles over the holiday. First of all, I am very new to burning. I use CloneDVD because I know the program and it works. I just started doing DL burns last week. Again, I used CloneDVD and it worked. Burning my factory copies of Deadwood on a SL blank caused too much compression and bad discs. With Any DVD running in the background all is good.
So I fail to see what I am doing wrong. Enlighten me please.
if it worked for you then you're not doing anything wrong.

Gurn is referring to the fact that clonedvd is a transcoder and is designed for compression purposes. He doesn't understand why one would use a transcoder when transcoding is not necessary...ie making a complete 1:1 copy of a disc onto dual layer media (either that or he had an unmentionable encounter with sheep as a child )

the actual problem is that clonedvd has problems with the layer break. I'm not a very technical person so I'm not sure if the issue is with preserving the layer break of the original disc or if it's in selecting an appropriate place for a layer break, but either way that part of clonedvd needs some improvement.

if it has worked for you then congratulations. keep doing it that way, but keep in mind that the issue does exist, and dvd decrypter/ImgBurn have the capability of more successfully dealing with the layer break.

also, this isn't just here-say from people who have had problems with clonedvd...it's an actual function that clonedvd does not, as of yet, possess.

i don't know to explain your luck because I've had nothing but nightmares trying to copy dual layer discs with clonedvd, but I'm sure there are many like you who hav enot yet (and may never) see a problem.

Just be advised that if you do have a problem, it's a known issue and the current solution is to use dvd decrypter/ImgBurn as described above.
reasonsnotrules is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-12-2005   #22
CD Freaks Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Vancouver, U.S.A.
Posts: 33
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

I do have DVD Decrypter. Haven't figured out how to use it yet though. The first disc was tested and it played just fine. I have since burned disc 2 and 3 of Deadwood, but have not watched them yet. It sounds like I should though. Maybe I got lucky on my first DL burn.
__________________
Old System:
Athlon XP2000
TI 4600 Video Card
Raptor 34 gig SATA HD
BenQ 1640A DVD Writer
Firefox!!!
New rig data coming soon!
____________________
amp: Yamaha DSP-A1.
TV: Pioneer Elite Pro FHD 1
DVD: Toshiba HD XA-2.
LD: Pioneer CLD-97 w/AC-3.
HD tuner: LG LSS-3200A.
Speakers: Monitor Audio Silver.
Velodyne 12" Sub.

Last edited by amboyna; 28-12-2005 at 04:36. Reason: Add Scan
amboyna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-12-2005   #23
CD Freaks Rookie
 
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Vancouver, U.S.A.
Posts: 33
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Gurm
Dual Layer burning is a black art.

The only sure way to get it to work - assuming your drive and media can handle it - is to use DVD Decrypter.

Mode->ISO READ
Mode->ISO WRITE

That's it!
There must be more to it than that. When you hit mode-> ISO READ;
Is that when it rips to the HD?
__________________
Old System:
Athlon XP2000
TI 4600 Video Card
Raptor 34 gig SATA HD
BenQ 1640A DVD Writer
Firefox!!!
New rig data coming soon!
____________________
amp: Yamaha DSP-A1.
TV: Pioneer Elite Pro FHD 1
DVD: Toshiba HD XA-2.
LD: Pioneer CLD-97 w/AC-3.
HD tuner: LG LSS-3200A.
Speakers: Monitor Audio Silver.
Velodyne 12" Sub.
amboyna is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-12-2005   #24
CDFreaks Resident
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,940
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by amboyna
There must be more to it than that.
No, no there really isn't.

Quote:
When you hit mode-> ISO READ;
Is that when it rips to the HD?
Well, ok. I confess you must also hit the BIG GREEN BUTTON.
Gurm is offline   Reply With Quote
Old 28-12-2005   #25
CDFreaks Resident
 
Join Date: Aug 2002
Posts: 1,940
Re: How to burn onto DL Dual Layer Disc? Problems.

Quote:
Originally Posted by amboyna
I do have DVD Decrypter. Haven't figured out how to use it yet though.
*sigh*

Why do I keep doing this?

Embedded Images

View/download images and remove advertisements by registering now! (it's easy, free and takes less than a minute)

You must be registered in order view images in this forum.


Embedded Images

View/download images and remove advertisements by registering now! (it's easy, free and takes less than a minute)

You must be registered in order view images in this forum.


How hard was that?
Gurm is offline   Reply With Quote
Reply


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
Trackbacks are Off
Pingbacks are Off
Refbacks are Off


Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Plextor 750 Wont Burn Dual Layer Disc mlitd Plextor Writer 3 27-05-2006 12:08
Copied to a Dual-layer disc but fails at layer change! malscott Newbie Forum 11 25-03-2006 11:37
Cant burn Dual Layer disc with NEC 2510a comandercody Newbie Forum 4 13-12-2004 20:18
Mac 3500AG Dual-layer burn problems obsolete777 NEC / Optiarc Writer 1 26-10-2004 03:33
How To Burn Dual Layer disc kwkard Burning Software 1 26-07-2004 00:01


All times are GMT +2. The time now is 00:27.
Top